[{"id":"1276","cataloger_name":["Masoumeh,Zaare"],"partnerInstitution":["Concordia University"],"collection_source_collection":["SGWU Reading Series-Concordia University Department of English fonds"],"source_collection_label":["SGWU Reading Series-Concordia University Department of English fonds"],"collection_contributing_unit":["Records Management and Archives"],"source_collection_uri":[""],"collection_image_url":[""],"collection_source_collection_description":["The fonds consists of some administrative records of the SGWU Department of English and the Concordia Department of English between 1971 and 2000. It also consists of some SGWU Department of English records related to student academic activities in the 1940s and to public readings and lectures, and a few interviews, produced between 1966 and 1972. The fonds mainly includes minutes of departmental meetings and some course timetables. It also includes some student papers in bound volumes and 63 sound recordings (80 audio reels) mainly composed of poetry readings (see the Concordia SpokenWeb project which uses this material) but also a few lectures given at SGWU. There are also loose typed sheets describing some of the SGWU poetry readings."],"collection_source_collection_id":["I086"],"persistent_url":["http://archives.concordia.ca/I086"],"item_title":["Eli Mandel and D.G. Jones at Sir George Williams University, The Poetry Series, 7 March 1969"],"item_title_source":["Cataloguer"],"item_title_note":["\"JONES & MANDEL I006/SR43\" written on sticker on the spine of the tape's box. JONES & MANDEL refers to D.G. Jones and Eli Mandel. \"I006-11-043\" written on sticker on the reel\n\n\"Poetry - 7th Mar/69 Eli Mandel & Jones -1 I086-11-034\" written on the spine of the tape's box. Jones refers to D.G. Jones. \"1 Mandel I086-11-034\" written on sticker on the reel. \"RT 510\" written on sticker on the front of the tape's box and written on the back of the tape's box."],"item_language":["English"],"item_production_context":["Documentary recording"],"item_series_title":["The Poetry Series"],"item_subseries_title":["Poetry 3"],"item_identifiers":["[I006-11-043, I086-11-034]"],"creator_names":["Jones, Douglas Gordon","Mandel, Eli"],"creator_names_search":["Jones, Douglas Gordon","Mandel, Eli"],"creators":["[{\"url\":\"http://viaf.org/viaf/41883605\",\"name\":\"Jones, Douglas Gordon\",\"dates\":\"1929-2016\",\"notes\":\"Poet and critic Douglas Gordon (D.G.) Jones was born in Bancroft Ontario in 1929. He completed his B.A. at McGill University in 1952 and an M.A. at Queen’s University in 1954, writing a thesis on Ezra Pound. Jones’ first poems were encouraged by Louis Dudek and Raymond Souster in his publications in Contact Press and Delta. His first collection of poetry, Frost on the Sun (Contact Press, 1957) was followed by The Sun is Axeman (University of Toronto Press, 1961), Phrases from Orpheus (Oxford University Press, 1967) and a winner of a Governor General’s Award for Poetry, Under the Thunder of the Flowers Light Up the Earth (Coach House Press, 1977), A Throw of Particles (General Publishing Company, 1983), Balthazar (Coach House Press, 1988) and The floating garden (Coach House Press, 1995). Jones taught first at the Royal Military College from 1954-5, the Ontario Agricultural College from 1955-1961, he moved to Quebec and taught at Bishop’s University from 1961-1963, and finally at the Universite de Sherbooke, from 1963-1994. His book, Butterfly on rock: a study of themes and images in Canadian literature (University of Toronto Press, 1970) on Canadian criticism has proven to be important in the shaping of that field's literature. He founded Ellipse in 1969, the only Canadian magazine in which both English and French poetry was reciprocally translated. Jones’ own translations include Paul-Marie Lapointe’s The terror of the snows (University of Pittsburgh Press, 1976), The march to love: Selected poems of Gaston Miron (International Poetry Forum, 1986), Normand de Bellefeuille’s Categorics, one, two & three (Coach House Press, 1992) which won the Governor General’s Award for translation and Emile Martel’s For orchestra and solo poet (Muses’ Co, 1996). D.G. Jones was made an Officer of the Order of Canada in 2007. Jones died in 2016. \",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Author\",\"Performer\"]},{\"url\":\"http://viaf.org/viaf/59095399\",\"name\":\"Mandel, Eli\",\"dates\":\"1922-1992\",\"notes\":\"Poet, critic and editor Eli Mandel was born Elias Wolf Mandel in Estevan, Saskatchewan in 1922. He grew up in Regina, until the Second World War when he joined the Army Medical Corps. Upon his return, he studied at the University of Saskatchewan, earning his B.A. in 1949, going on to complete his M.A. in 1950. Mandel then moved east, where he received a Ph.D. in 1957 from the University of Toronto. His early poetry was published in magazines like CIV/N and Contact, and in 1954 Contact Press published his collection “Minotaur poems” in Trio with Gael Turnbull and Phyllis Webb. Mandel taught English at College Militaire Royal de Saint Jean, University of Alberta and York University in Toronto, as well as serving as visiting professor and writer-in-residence later on in his career. He also wrote many important essays on Canadian literature, art and society, promoting Canadian writers. Poetry 62 (Ryerson Press, 1961), Mandel’s first anthology, co-edited with Jean-Guy Pilon, collected the works of (then) little-known writers Al Purdy, Milton Acorn, D.G. Jones, Alden Nowlan, Leonard Cohen and John Robert Colombo. His second collection of poems was published in Fuseli Poems (Contact Press, 1960), followed by Black and Secret Man (Ryerson Press, 1964), and An Idiot Joy (Hurtig Press, 1967), which won the Governor General’s award. A collection of eight essays by Mandel that had been presented as radio talks for CBC was published in Criticism: the silent-speaking words in 1966 (CBC). His later anthologies include Five modern Canadian poets (Holt, Rinehart and Winston, 1970), English poems of the twentieth century (Macmillan, 1971), Contexts of Canadian Criticism (University of Chicago Press, 1971), Eight more Canadian poets (Holt, Rinehart and Winston, 1972), and Poets of contemporary Canada: 1960-1970 (Macmillan, 1972) which published Joe Rosenblatt and bill bissett’s first collections of poetry. Mandel’s other works include Stony Plain (Porcepic Press, 1973), Crusoe (Anansi, 1973), Out of Place (Porcepic Press, 1977), the long poem Mary Midnight (Coach House Press, 1979), Life Sentence (Porcepic Press, 1981), Dreaming backwards: selected poems (General Publishing, 1981), the collections of essays Another Time (Porcepic, 1977), and The family romance (Turnstone, 1986) as well as a book-length study of his colleague, Irving Layton called The Poetry of Irving Layton (Coles, 1969). An important figure in Canadian literature, Eli Mandel died in Toronto on September 3, 1992.\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Author\",\"Performer\"]}]"],"contributors_names":["Unspecified","Bowering, George"],"contributors_names_search":["Unspecified","Bowering, George"],"contributors":["[{\"url\":\"\",\"name\":\"Unspecified \",\"dates\":\"\",\"notes\":\"\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Recordist\"]},{\"url\":\"http://viaf.org/viaf/34469976\",\"name\":\"Bowering, George\",\"dates\":\"1935-\",\"notes\":\"\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Series organizer\",\"Presenter\"]}]"],"Presenter_name":["Bowering, George"],"Recordist_name":["Unspecified "],"Series_organizer_name":["Bowering, George"],"Performance_Date":[1969],"material_description":["[{\"side\":\"\",\"image\":\"\",\"other\":\"\",\"extent\":\"1/4 inch\",\"AV_types\":\"Audio\",\"tape_brand\":\"Scotch\",\"generations\":\"\",\"Conservation\":\"\",\"equalization\":\"\",\"playback_mode\":\"Mono\",\"playing_speed\":\"3 3/4 ips\",\"sound_quality\":\"Good\",\"recording_type\":\"Analogue\",\"storage_capacity\":\"\",\"physical_condition\":\"\",\"track_configuration\":\"Half-track\",\"material_designation\":\"Reel to Reel\",\"physical_composition\":\"Magnetic Tape\",\"accompanying_material\":\"\",\"other_physical_description\":\"\"},{\"side\":\"\",\"image\":\"\",\"other\":\"\",\"extent\":\"1/4 inch\",\"AV_types\":\"Audio\",\"tape_brand\":\"Scotch\",\"generations\":\"\",\"Conservation\":\"\",\"equalization\":\"\",\"playback_mode\":\"Mono\",\"playing_speed\":\"3 3/4 ips\",\"sound_quality\":\"Good\",\"recording_type\":\"Analogue\",\"storage_capacity\":\"\",\"physical_condition\":\"First part of the tape is repeated from the end of I086-11-034\",\"track_configuration\":\"Half-track\",\"material_designation\":\"Reel to Reel\",\"physical_composition\":\"Magnetic Tape\",\"accompanying_material\":\"\",\"other_physical_description\":\"\"}]"],"material_designations":["Reel to Reel","Reel to Reel"],"physical_compositions":["Magnetic Tape","Magnetic Tape"],"recording_type":["Analogue","Analogue"],"AV_type":["Audio","Audio"],"playback_mode":["Mono","Mono"],"Dates":["[{\"date\":\"1969 3 7\",\"type\":\"Performance Date\",\"notes\":\"\",\"source\":\"Previous researcher\"}]"],"Location":["[{\"url\":\"https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/22080570\",\"venue\":\"Hall Building\",\"notes\":\"Exact venue location unknown\",\"address\":\"1455, Boul de Maisonneuve Ouest, Montreal, Quebec, Canada\",\"latitude\":\" 45.4972758\",\"longitude\":\" -73.57893043\"}]"],"Address":["1455, Boul de Maisonneuve Ouest, Montreal, Quebec, Canada"],"Venue":["Hall Building"],"City":["Montreal, Quebec"],"content_notes":["Eli Mandel reads from An Idiot Joy (Hurtig, 1967), Black and Secret Man (1964), Trio:  First Poems (Contact Press, 1954), as well as poems later published in Crusoe: Poems Selected and New (Anansi, 1973). D.G. Jones reads from Phrases from Orpheus (Oxford University Press, 1967), as well as a few that were published later in Under the Thunder the Flowers Light up the Earth (Coach House Press, 1977) and an unnamed long poem that may have been published in Poetry 62 (Ryerson Press 1961)."],"contents":["eli_mandel_i086-11-034.mp3 [File 1 of 2]\n \nGeorge Bowering\n00:00:00\n...start with the poesy, I've been asked to announce that on Friday, i.e., what's this the seventh? Two weeks from tonight, March the 21st at 9 o’clock. in Room 653, [Barnes (?)] willing, there will be a program, I guess within the auspices of the Fine Arts department, the Ira Cohen [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1097790], New York [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q60] film maker, and poet will be showing three of his films, as far as I know for the first time in Montreal [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q340]. That's two weeks tonight at 9 in 653. When I was asked to introduce Eli Mandel [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3050883], and D.G. Jones [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q5203595], I said, 'that's ridiculous', Canadian poetry being the way it is, they already know each other. And after the moment of hilarity I was brought to my senses, and I began to think that it really did make a lot of sense that we do have Doug Jones and Eli Mandel reading on the same program. I can remember in 1961 when Poetry 62 came out, Canadian poetry being the way it is [audience laughter], Poetry 62 was edited by Jean-Guy Pilon [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3166089] I believe and Eli Mandel, being a bilingual book, and at the time the poem that struck me as the most interesting was the long poem by D.G. Jones, the most interesting in that anthology, and I therefore, felt kind of warm, without having them, to both of them to Doug's poem and Eli's great taste for putting it in the anthology. And then I thought that there was this kind of confluence going on and I began to see all kinds of other things happening too, for instance, they both had their first books published by Contact Press, that published the first books of most of the important Canadian poets, and they now have seen their careers sort of criss-cross one another in a kind of a funny way because they each have three books, except that Eli has three and a third, which is also kind of Canadian, and I thought it was kind of interesting because not only is there a kind of parallel going on, and they both in 1967, for instance, turned out very good books of poetry, but there's a kind of uh, they'll be kind of an interesting contrast I think in tonight's program because I've always considered that Doug Jones is sort of the best of the Ontario [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1904] Wasp poets [audience laughter], and Eli Mandel is the best of the Western Jewish poets and they both deal with essential problems that seem to expose their two opposing and therefore contrary and conjugal, you might almost say, attitudes towards the business of writing poems. So we're going to start off with Eli's reading, and then have something like a ten minute break, and then we'll have Doug Jones' reading. I should mention that of those two books, Eli's is called An Idiot Joy and it shared the Governor General's Award [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q283256] given in 1968, and published by Hurtig, Edmonton [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q2096] publisher, who is very pleased to get the Governor General's Award, and Doug Jones' book is Phrases from Orpheus, published by Oxford Press [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q217595], two books that would be well worth investing both your heaven, forbid, money and your imagination upon. I'm probably not going to say anything before D.G. Jones comes to read, so I'm not expecting to come up here and spout for five or ten minutes before he reads and I'm not going to spout any longer before Eli reads. So I'd first like to introduce to you Mr. Eli Mandel.\n\nAudience\n00:05:01\nApplause. \n \nEli Mandel\n00:05:29\nI think George [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1239280] might have carried the parallel of contrasts and comparisons a little further had he wanted to, or chosen to, or had he known about certain very intimate details about Doug's life and my life. But I don't propose to go into those myself right now either [audience laughter]. Instead, I'm going to read, primarily from An Idiot Joy, but also from Black and Secret Man, which was an earlier book and also from one or two manuscript poems that I've been working on recently. I want to start with a poem called \"Signatures\" and although I can say a lot about a number of poems that I've written, I'm not sure I can say much about this except that as will be obvious to you I think, the imagery is drawn from the Vietnam [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q881] conflict, though I don't know that the poem is necessarily about that. Can you hear me with this mic? Some people at the back are saying 'no'. Can you hear me now?\n \nEli Mandel\n00:07:00\nReads \"Signatures\" [from An Idiot Joy].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:09:27\nThis poem is called \"Neither Here Nor There\".\n \nEli Mandel\n00:09:33\nReads \"Neither Here Nor There\" [published later in Crusoe: Poems Selected and New].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:10:28\nThis is a poem from Black and Secret Man and it's called \"The Direction is North Until the Pole\", and I suppose it's one of the few poems I've written that I would call a Canadian poem, that is to say it draws on a number of specific images from the Canadian landscape and therefore I have to annotate this poem. I have to tell you that the Fleming mentioned in the last line of the poem was once a Minister of Finance in the federal government, that just proves how transient political poems really are. I think all the rest of this should be clear, hockey is a game that's played in Canada [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q16].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:11:16\nReads \"The Direction is North Until the Pole\" from Black and Secret Man.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:13:24\nThis is one of my prophetic poems. I think I've written a lot of really prophetic poems. This poem is called \"Departure\" and it tells about leaving Edmonton. Everybody who has read the poem believes that I wrote it when I decided to leave Edmonton, either for the first time or the second time, I've left there twice, as a matter of fact, I didn't write it when I decided to leave in Edmonton, I wrote it when I arrived in Edmonton.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:13:53\nReads \"Departure\" [from Black and Secret Man].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:14:37\nA little poem about one of my perversions, this is about making love to pregnant women, I think, I'm not sure if there's a technical name for that but the perversion appears in the poem. The poem's called \"Cassandra\" and it's about a prophetess, Cassandra [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q170779], you'll remember was the woman that Agamemnon [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q128176]  brought home with him to his wife, Clytemnestra [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q131157], and this, so angered Clytemnestra, aside from the fact that Agamemnon had killed one of their daughters, that she killed Agamemnon, but Cassandra was a Prophetess, like Prophetesses, was given the power to tell the truth and was never believed. Some of the imagery in this poem is taken from the story of Cassandra, and the rest from my perversions.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:15:39\nReads \"Cassandra\" [from Black and Secret Man].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:17:00\nReads \"The Madness of our Polity\" [from An Idiot Joy].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:17:46\n\"Whence Cometh Our Help?\", the title is taken from the Psalms [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q41064], and there are a number of images of the Psalms, in the poem. Or images from the Psalms.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:18:04\nReads \"Whence Cometh Our Help?\" [from An Idiot Joy].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:19:03\nThis poem is called \"Manner of Suicide\", and it's the closest thing I've come to writing a found poem, in that all the material in the poem, the words are taken from two sources, except for the first line. One is Karl Menninger's [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3080926] Man Against Himself and the other, the Jewish Daily Prayer Book. There are twenty-six ways listed here of committing suicide, they're all ways that Menninger lists and documents, and he lists them in the order in which I give them here, and this list, which I give, is then followed by some comments he makes about those ways of committing suicide and a passage from the prayer book.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:20:11\nReads \"Manner of Suicide\" [from An Idiot Joy].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:23:24\nIn An Idiot Joy I wrote a number of poems which were, which used two primary images, the image of the moon and the image of the sea, and these are love poems. I suppose the interesting thing in them to me, aside from the personal sense that I feel about them, is that with each of the poems, whether it's with the image of the moon or the image of the sea, or both, I keep trying different technical things in the poetry, and so far as I'm concerned, I've done some more interesting technical things in this than anywhere else, but primarily, the poems talk about the moon and the sea, and seabirds and women and a woman.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:24:30\nReads \"Woman in the Moon\" from An Idiot Joy.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:26:12\nReads \"The Explanations of the Moon” [from An Idiot Joy].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:27:32\nThis is one of the sea poems, in the sequence, called \"Listen, the Sea\", and the title comes from King Lear [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q181598], though actually, I had become aware of it of course when I knew that Keats [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q82083] had written a sonnet using this, but the technique is neither Shakespearean nor Keatsean, nothing of the kind.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:28:00\nReads \"Listen, the Sea\" [from An Idiot Joy].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:29:01\nAnd \"Marina\", who is a daughter of the sea.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:29:09\nReads \"Marina\" [from An Idiot Joy].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:30:46\nWell something quite different. I think I should dedicate this to George Bowering, because I wrote the poem after I had been…\n\nUnknown\n00:30:56\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n\nEli Mandel\n00:30:57\nAnd I would have to apologize for this, but the last thing in the world that I wanted to do was apologize, I'd prefer anything but that, I mean this is pretty simple-minded simplistic psychology, of the worst order I suppose, I just--I'm writing a poem about how stupid I felt at that particular moment.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:31:17\nReads \"The Apology\" [from An Idiot Joy].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:34:34\nThis is the poem I like to think of as the one that one would put in a time capsule, it's called \"Letter to be Opened Later\" and presumably each one of us wants to immortalize oneself, and imagine, you know, two thousand years later the time capsule being opened and then they can read your letter. This is my letter, to be opened later.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:35:12\nReads \"Letter to be Opened Later\" [published later in Crusoe: Poems Selected and New ].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:36:09\nI'm going to read a lyric, it's a very short poem, but I'd like to read this one anyhow. It's called \"To My Children\" and it's based upon both an odd and rather terrifying coincidence in my life and a curious Jewish tradition. The Jewish tradition is that you name a child after the nearest dead relative, the relative who has died most recently and who is closest to one, and it so happened that my mother died, my daughter was born, my father died and my son was born. And I wrote this poem about the naming of the children. It's called \"To My Children\".\n \nEli Mandel\n00:37:08\nReads \"To My Children\" [from Black and Secret Man].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:38:00\nNow I'm going to finish this reading with two poems, one is called \"The Meaning of the I Ching\" and the other \"Cosmos: the Giant Rose\"--three poems, I'm sorry. I'm going to read \"Pictures in an Institution\" as well. \"The Meaning of the I Ching\", the I Ching [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q181937] as you probably know is a book of divination, it's the oldest book of divination known, and when I first heard about it, I looked at the book before I opened it and I wondered about the very simple notion of a book that old telling my future. How could I be contained in this ancient book? And I wrote this poem. Now it seems to me that there is something remarkable here, it's one claim I will make for the poem, at least, in the poem, is the first time I used the phrase \"earth upon earth\" and the very first hexagram that I cast when I opened the book. The book tells fortunes with what are called hexagrams and hexagrams are given various names, the very first one that I cast was the hexagram \"earth upon earth\" and that's simply something that happened whether it means that the poem is prophetic or magical, I don't know.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:39:36\nReads \"The Meaning of the I Ching\" [from An Idiot Joy].\n \nEli Mandel\n00:43:18\nI'm going to finish now reading \"Pictures in an Institution\". This is the most personal poem I've ever written, and I don't want to read anything after that, so I'm going to finish with this. \"Pictures in an Institution\". I think all I need to say about this is that it plays off notices against some personal experiences and I think that'll be plain enough.\n \nEli Mandel\n00:43:43\nReads \"Pictures in an Institution\" [from Trio: First Poems by Gael Turnbull, Phyllis Webb, and Eli Mandel].\n\nEli Mandel\n00:47:40\nThank you.\n\nAudience\n00:47:41\nApplause.\n\nUnknown\n00:47:51\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n\nUnknown\n00:47:53\nAmbient Sound [voices].\n\nGeorge Bowering\n00:48:22\nI'd like to help you welcome now, D.G. Jones.\n \nAudience\n00:48:27\nApplause.\n\nD.G. Jones\n00:48:60\nI'm going to do this because I'm thirsty. It's a little disturbing but I've had a suspicion that this was becoming true for some time, in the last few years, that pretty soon you won't be able to tell the Jew from the Wasp, anyway [audience laughter]. It's getting more disconcerting all the time how similar certain things are between me and Eli Mandel [audience laughter]. I just hope he's a very good person and lives a long life and has great success in the future [audience laughter]. The main thing I want to read tonight is a little bit like Eli's last poem [audience laughter]. But it takes a lot more time to get itself said, for good or ill, and I'd like to read a few, a couple shorter poems anyway, before starting that longer poem which takes up a fair amount of the time. I'll read the first book from the, I mean...[laughter], I'll read the first poem from the book which old oriental George Bowering told you about at the beginning of the program. This poem's called \"The Perishing Bird\".\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:51:12\nReads \"The Perishing Bird\" [from Phrases from Orpheus].\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:53:16\nA poem called \"Summer is a Poem by Ovid\".\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:53:34\nReads \"Summer is a Poem by Ovid\" [from Phrases from Orpheus].\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:54:41\nWell, this reads well. It starts with a Latin title, it's a kind of letter, actually written in reply to a letter to somebody who accused me of being rather complacent when ironically enough, I felt anything but that at that time. Accused me of being one of the people who didn't have any troubles in life, or not only me but somebody else too, when we had quite a few of our own that were not too dissimilar from those that the other person was talking about. It's about marriage. It's called, to avoid looking too obvious, \"De Profundis Conjugii Vox et Responsum''. It's a serious poem though, more or less.\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:55:56\nReads \"De Profundis Conjugii Vox et Responsum\" [from Phrases from Orpheus].\n \nEND\n01:01:57\n\n\ndg-jones_i006-11-04-2.mp3 [File 2 of 2]\n \nGeorge Bowering\n00:00:00\nI'd like to help you welcome now, D.G. Jones.\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:00:13\nI'm going to do this because I'm thirsty. It's a little disturbing but I've had a suspicion that this was becoming true for some time, in the last few years, that pretty soon you won't be able to tell the Jew from the Wasp, anyway. It's getting more disconcerting all the time how similar certain things are between me and Eli Mandel. I just hope he's a very good person and lives a long life and has great success in the future. [Audience laughter]. The main thing I want to read tonight is a little bit like Eli's last poem. [laughter]. But it takes a lot more time to get itself said, for good or ill, and I'd like to read a few, a couple shorter poems anyway, before starting that longer poem which takes up a fair amount of the time. I'll read the first book, I mean...[laughter], I'll read the first poem from the book which old oriental George Bowering told you about at the beginning of the program. This poem's called \"The Perishing Bird\".\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:02:53\nReads \"The Perishing Bird\" [from Phrases from Orpheus].\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:05:05\nA poem called \"Summer is a Poem by Ovid\" .\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:05:20\nReads \"Summer is a Poem by Ovid\".\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:06:35\nWell, this reads well. It starts with a Latin title, it's a kind of letter, actually written in reply to a letter to somebody who accused me of being rather complacent when ironically enough, I felt anything but that at that time. Accused me of being one of the people who didn't have any troubles in life, or not only me but somebody else too, when we had quite a few of our own that were not too dissimilar from those that the other person was talking about. It's about marriage. It's called, to avoid looking too obvious, \"De Profundis Conjugii Vox et Responsum''. It's a serious poem though, more or less.\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:07:49\nReads “De Profundis Conjugii Vox et Responsum” [from Phrases from Orpheus].\n \nUnknown\n00:13:55\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n\nD.G. Jones\n00:13:56\n...features of it, particularly carved doors or doors with glass panels carved, and a fountain, whoops. Wrong poem [audience laughter], same person [audience laughter]. The other one was written without any picture, this was written with a picture, \"On a Picture of Your House\".\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:14:49\nReads \"On a Picture of Your House\" [from Phrases from Orpheus].\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:16:44\nThis poem is the long poem I referred to, it's a kind of confessional poem, it's only about, I suppose, ten years behind Robert Lowell [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q981448] and the other American poets who have been writing what the critics now call confessional poetry, which is about par, I suppose. This poem was more or less actually complete several years ago, but I got so many things into the poem I wasn't sure how I was going to get out. And I've dickied around with it and possibly added a few more things, and finally I kept what I had in the end anyway, which was simply a way of ducking out I suspect. Though I hope there's some kind of peculiar relationship to the end, and everything else. I haven't been able to find a title for it. \"Night Thoughts\", might do, but somebody used that. But it's something along this line: the situation, the scheme is to present a kind of series of reminiscences, mediations, memories which disintegrate and become a little more peculiar as time goes on. Then suddenly stops, breaks off with morning. And it's set more or less around my cottage that I had, in Ontario, which wasn't far from where I was born. This is written in sections but I won't bother reading all the numbers, I'll just pause and go on.\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:19:00\nReads unnamed poem.\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:41:22\nExcuse me, I'll read the last point, I was almost there, but I think I'll skip that part.\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:41:30\nResumes reading unnamed poem.\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:42:35\nExcuse me, I didn't feel I was reading that very well. Sorry, it is perhaps a little long. I'll finish quickly. I'd like to just read something a little different. I'll read two poems, one called \"Spring Flowers\", which will be the first.\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:43:22\nReads \"Spring Flowers\" [published later in Under the Thunder the Flowers Light up the Earth]\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:43:56\nI seem to be running out of steam. There's one here that's short enough I should be able to get all the way through it. It's called \"Under the Thunder\", and that's the first line.\n\nD.G. Jones\n00:44:15\nReads \"Under the Thunder\" [poem read is the title of a later publication, Under the Thunder the Flowers Light up the Earth].\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:44:21\nI'll try one more [audience laughter]. This was written for a number of people who got together--to form a society of a somewhat antiquated name, The League of Canadian Poets [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6509004], who met in Toronto [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q172] in October 1968. It's called \"To Certain Poets Who Met in Toronto, October 1968\" [audience laughter].\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:45:03\nReads \"To Certain Poets Who Met in Toronto, October 1968\".\n \nD.G. Jones\n00:46:40\nI think I'm sorry, I've run out of steam but...\n \nEND\n00:46:49\n[Cut off abruptly].\n"],"Note":["[{\"note\":\"Year-Specific Information:\\n\\nIn 1969, Mandel was a professor at York University in Toronto, and he had published The Poetry of Irving Layton. He was also working on an anthology Five Modern Canadian Poets, published in 1970.\\n\\nIn 1969, D.G. Jones had founded Ellipse, and was teaching at the Universite de Sherbrooke.\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"Local Connections: \\n\\nThough no direct connections to Sir George Williams University are known, Eli Mandel’s work has been essential and influential in promoting the work of Canadian authors and poets, through his anthologizing and editing, his essay writing as well as his poetry.\\n\\nD.G. Jones has had a very influential role in Canadian and in specific Quebec poetry, as a leader in the translations of both English and French poetry. His criticism of Canadian literature places him with Margaret Atwood and Northrop Frye in shaping Canada’s literary canon and its literature. Jones was associated with poets such as Bowering, Dudek and Layton and F.R. Scott.\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"Original transcript, research, introduction and edits by Celyn Harding-Jones\\n\\nAdditional research and edits by Ali Barillaro\",\"type\":\"Cataloguer\"},{\"note\":\"2 reel-to-reel tapes>2 CDs>2 digital files\",\"type\":\"Preservation\"}]"],"Related_works":["[{\"url\":\"https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/douglas-gordon-jones\",\"citation\":\"Blodgett, E.D. “Jones, Douglas Gordon”. The Canadian Encyclopedia. Historica-Dominion, 2008. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/contemporary-canadian-poem-anthology/oclc/476332314&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Bowering, George, ed. The Contemporary Canadian Poem Anthology. Toronto: Coach House Press, 1984. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/eli-mandel\",\"citation\":\"Boyd, Colin. “Mandel, Eli”. The Canadian Encyclopedia. Historica-Dominion, 2008.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/oxford-companion-to-canadian-literature/oclc/605246871&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Davey, Frank. \\\"Mandel, Eli\\\". The Oxford Companion to Canadian Literature. Eugene Benson and William Toye (eds). Oxford University Press 2001.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/fr-scott-une-vie-biographie/oclc/1132465721&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Djwa, Sandra. F.R. Scott: Une Vie, biographie. Montreal: Boreal, 2001. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/15-canadian-poets-x2/oclc/40224711&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Geddes, Gary. Fifteen Canadian Poets Times Two. Toronto: Oxford University Press, 1990.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/encyclopedia-of-post-colonial-literatures-in-english-vol2/oclc/1156824609&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Harrison, James. “Jones, Douglas Gordon (1929-)”. Routledge Encyclopedia of Post-Colonial  Literatures in English. Benson, Eugene; Conolly, L.W. (eds). London: Routledge, 1994. 2 vols. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/phrases-from-orpheus-by-jones/oclc/503359867&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Jones, D.G.. Phrases From Orpheus. Toronto: Oxford University Press, 1967.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/under-the-thunder-the-flowers-light-up-the-earth/oclc/3901520&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Jones, D.G.. Under the Thunder the Flowers Light up the Earth. Toronto: Coach House Press, 1977. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/idiot-joy/oclc/468767134?referer=di&ht=edition\",\"citation\":\"Mandel, Eli. An Idiot Joy. Edmonton: Hurtig, 1967.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/black-and-secret-man/oclc/247643578?referer=di&ht=edition\",\"citation\":\"Mandel, Eli. Black and Secret Man. Toronto: Ryerson Press, 1964.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/crusoe-poems-selected-and-new/oclc/1419679&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Mandel, Eli. Crusoe: Poems Selected and New. Toronto: Anansi, 1973. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/trio/oclc/224515443&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Mandel, Eli., Turnbull, Gael., and Phyllis Webb. Trio: First Poems. Toronto: Contact Press, 1954\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/poetry-62/oclc/5110944&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Mandel, Eli and Jean-Guy Pilon. Poetry 62. Toronto: Ryerson Press, 1961.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/encyclopedia-of-post-colonial-literatures-in-english-vol2/oclc/1156824609&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Stubbs, Andrew. “Mandel, Eli (1922-1992)”. Routledge Encyclopedia of Post-Colonial    Literatures in English. Benson, Eugene; Connolly, L.W. (eds). London: Routledge, 1994.      2 vols.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/oxford-companion-to-canadian-literature/oclc/605246871&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Woodcock, George. \\\"Jones, D.G.\\\"  The Oxford Companion to Canadian Literature. Eugene Benson and William Toye. Oxford University Press 2001. \"}]"],"_version_":1853670548880490496,"timestamp":"2026-01-07T14:59:53.477Z","digital_description":["[{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0086_11_0034_back.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0086_11_0025_back.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Mandel and Jones Tape Box 2 - Back\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0086_11_0034_front.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0086_11_0025_front.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Mandel and Jones Tape Box 2 - 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Reel\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://files.spokenweb.ca/concordia/sgw/audio/all_mp3/dg-jones_i006-11-043-2.mp3\",\"file_path\":\"files.spokenweb.ca>concordia>sgw>audio>all_mp3\",\"filename\":\"dg-jones_i006-11-04-2.mp3\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"00:46:49\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"112.4 MB\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"dg-jones_i006-11-04-2.mp3 [File 2 of 2]\\n \\nGeorge Bowering\\n00:00:00\\nI'd like to help you welcome now, D.G. Jones.\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:00:13\\nI'm going to do this because I'm thirsty. It's a little disturbing but I've had a suspicion that this was becoming true for some time, in the last few years, that pretty soon you won't be able to tell the Jew from the Wasp, anyway. It's getting more disconcerting all the time how similar certain things are between me and Eli Mandel. I just hope he's a very good person and lives a long life and has great success in the future. [Audience laughter]. The main thing I want to read tonight is a little bit like Eli's last poem. [laughter]. But it takes a lot more time to get itself said, for good or ill, and I'd like to read a few, a couple shorter poems anyway, before starting that longer poem which takes up a fair amount of the time. I'll read the first book, I mean...[laughter], I'll read the first poem from the book which old oriental George Bowering told you about at the beginning of the program. This poem's called \\\"The Perishing Bird\\\".\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:02:53\\nReads \\\"The Perishing Bird\\\" [from Phrases from Orpheus].\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:05:05\\nA poem called \\\"Summer is a Poem by Ovid\\\" .\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:05:20\\nReads \\\"Summer is a Poem by Ovid\\\".\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:06:35\\nWell, this reads well. It starts with a Latin title, it's a kind of letter, actually written in reply to a letter to somebody who accused me of being rather complacent when ironically enough, I felt anything but that at that time. Accused me of being one of the people who didn't have any troubles in life, or not only me but somebody else too, when we had quite a few of our own that were not too dissimilar from those that the other person was talking about. It's about marriage. It's called, to avoid looking too obvious, \\\"De Profundis Conjugii Vox et Responsum''. It's a serious poem though, more or less.\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:07:49\\nReads “De Profundis Conjugii Vox et Responsum” [from Phrases from Orpheus].\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:13:55\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n\\nD.G. Jones\\n00:13:56\\n...features of it, particularly carved doors or doors with glass panels carved, and a fountain, whoops. Wrong poem [audience laughter], same person [audience laughter]. The other one was written without any picture, this was written with a picture, \\\"On a Picture of Your House\\\".\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:14:49\\nReads \\\"On a Picture of Your House\\\" [from Phrases from Orpheus].\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:16:44\\nThis poem is the long poem I referred to, it's a kind of confessional poem, it's only about, I suppose, ten years behind Robert Lowell [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q981448] and the other American poets who have been writing what the critics now call confessional poetry, which is about par, I suppose. This poem was more or less actually complete several years ago, but I got so many things into the poem I wasn't sure how I was going to get out. And I've dickied around with it and possibly added a few more things, and finally I kept what I had in the end anyway, which was simply a way of ducking out I suspect. Though I hope there's some kind of peculiar relationship to the end, and everything else. I haven't been able to find a title for it. \\\"Night Thoughts\\\", might do, but somebody used that. But it's something along this line: the situation, the scheme is to present a kind of series of reminiscences, mediations, memories which disintegrate and become a little more peculiar as time goes on. Then suddenly stops, breaks off with morning. And it's set more or less around my cottage that I had, in Ontario, which wasn't far from where I was born. This is written in sections but I won't bother reading all the numbers, I'll just pause and go on.\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:19:00\\nReads unnamed poem.\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:41:22\\nExcuse me, I'll read the last point, I was almost there, but I think I'll skip that part.\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:41:30\\nResumes reading unnamed poem.\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:42:35\\nExcuse me, I didn't feel I was reading that very well. Sorry, it is perhaps a little long. I'll finish quickly. I'd like to just read something a little different. I'll read two poems, one called \\\"Spring Flowers\\\", which will be the first.\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:43:22\\nReads \\\"Spring Flowers\\\" [published later in Under the Thunder the Flowers Light up the Earth]\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:43:56\\nI seem to be running out of steam. There's one here that's short enough I should be able to get all the way through it. It's called \\\"Under the Thunder\\\", and that's the first line.\\n\\nD.G. Jones\\n00:44:15\\nReads \\\"Under the Thunder\\\" [poem read is the title of a later publication, Under the Thunder the Flowers Light up the Earth].\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:44:21\\nI'll try one more [audience laughter]. This was written for a number of people who got together--to form a society of a somewhat antiquated name, The League of Canadian Poets [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6509004], who met in Toronto [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q172] in October 1968. It's called \\\"To Certain Poets Who Met in Toronto, October 1968\\\" [audience laughter].\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:45:03\\nReads \\\"To Certain Poets Who Met in Toronto, October 1968\\\".\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:46:40\\nI think I'm sorry, I've run out of steam but...\\n \\nEND\\n00:46:49\\n[Cut off abruptly].\",\"notes\":\" D.G. Jones reads from Phrases from Orpheus (Oxford University Press, 1967), as well as a few that were published later in Under the Thunder the Flowers Light up the Earth (Coach House Press, 1977) and an unnamed long poem that may have been published in Poetry 62 (Ryerson Press 1961).\\n\\n00:00- George Bowering introduces D.G Jones [for full introduction, see I006-11-043.1 or I086-11-34]\\n00:13- D.G. Jones introduces “The Perishing Bird” [INDEX: Eli Mandel, George Bowering, Phrases from Orpheus; not on Howard Fink List of Poems]\\n02:53- Reads “The Perishing Bird”\\n05:20- Reads “Summer is a Poem by Ovid” [INDEX: not on Howard Fink List of Poems]\\n06:35- Introduces “De Profundis Conjugii Vox et Responsum” [INDEX: not on Howard Fink List of Poems.]\\n13:56- [CUT] Introduces “On a Picture of Your House”\\n14:49- Reads “On a Picture of Your House”\\n16:44- Introduces untitled poem, first line “The night is mild and the young moon...” [INDEX: confessional poem, Robert Lowell, process of writing, Ontario]\\n19:00- Reads first line “The night is mild and the young moon...”\\n42:35- Interrupts poem, introduces “Spring Flowers”\\n43:22- Reads “Spring Flowers”\\n43:56- Introduces “Under the Thunder”\\n44:15- Reads “Under the Thunder”\\n44:21- Introduces “To Certain Poets Who Met in Toronto, October 1968” [INDEX: The     \\tLeague of Canadian Poets meeting in Toronto, October 1968]\\n45:49- Reads “To Certain Poets Who Met in Toronto, October 1968”\\n46:49- END OF RECORDING\",\"title\":\"\",\"credit\":\"\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Sound Recording\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/sgw-poetry-readings/douglas-gordon-d-g-jones-at-sgwu-1969-george-bowering/\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://files.spokenweb.ca/concordia/sgw/audio/all_mp3/eli_mandel_i086-11-034.mp3\",\"file_path\":\"files.spokenweb.ca>concordia>sgw>audio>all_mp3\",\"filename\":\"eli_mandel_i086-11-034.mp3\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"01:01:57\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"148.7 MB\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"eli_mandel_i086-11-034.mp3 [File 1 of 2]\\n \\nGeorge Bowering\\n00:00:00\\n...start with the poesy, I've been asked to announce that on Friday, i.e., what's this the seventh? Two weeks from tonight, March the 21st at 9 o’clock. in Room 653, [Barnes (?)] willing, there will be a program, I guess within the auspices of the Fine Arts department, the Ira Cohen [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1097790], New York [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q60] film maker, and poet will be showing three of his films, as far as I know for the first time in Montreal [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q340]. That's two weeks tonight at 9 in 653. When I was asked to introduce Eli Mandel [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3050883], and D.G. Jones [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q5203595], I said, 'that's ridiculous', Canadian poetry being the way it is, they already know each other. And after the moment of hilarity I was brought to my senses, and I began to think that it really did make a lot of sense that we do have Doug Jones and Eli Mandel reading on the same program. I can remember in 1961 when Poetry 62 came out, Canadian poetry being the way it is [audience laughter], Poetry 62 was edited by Jean-Guy Pilon [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3166089] I believe and Eli Mandel, being a bilingual book, and at the time the poem that struck me as the most interesting was the long poem by D.G. Jones, the most interesting in that anthology, and I therefore, felt kind of warm, without having them, to both of them to Doug's poem and Eli's great taste for putting it in the anthology. And then I thought that there was this kind of confluence going on and I began to see all kinds of other things happening too, for instance, they both had their first books published by Contact Press, that published the first books of most of the important Canadian poets, and they now have seen their careers sort of criss-cross one another in a kind of a funny way because they each have three books, except that Eli has three and a third, which is also kind of Canadian, and I thought it was kind of interesting because not only is there a kind of parallel going on, and they both in 1967, for instance, turned out very good books of poetry, but there's a kind of uh, they'll be kind of an interesting contrast I think in tonight's program because I've always considered that Doug Jones is sort of the best of the Ontario [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1904] Wasp poets [audience laughter], and Eli Mandel is the best of the Western Jewish poets and they both deal with essential problems that seem to expose their two opposing and therefore contrary and conjugal, you might almost say, attitudes towards the business of writing poems. So we're going to start off with Eli's reading, and then have something like a ten minute break, and then we'll have Doug Jones' reading. I should mention that of those two books, Eli's is called An Idiot Joy and it shared the Governor General's Award [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q283256] given in 1968, and published by Hurtig, Edmonton [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q2096] publisher, who is very pleased to get the Governor General's Award, and Doug Jones' book is Phrases from Orpheus, published by Oxford Press [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q217595], two books that would be well worth investing both your heaven, forbid, money and your imagination upon. I'm probably not going to say anything before D.G. Jones comes to read, so I'm not expecting to come up here and spout for five or ten minutes before he reads and I'm not going to spout any longer before Eli reads. So I'd first like to introduce to you Mr. Eli Mandel.\\n\\nAudience\\n00:05:01\\nApplause. \\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:05:29\\nI think George [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1239280] might have carried the parallel of contrasts and comparisons a little further had he wanted to, or chosen to, or had he known about certain very intimate details about Doug's life and my life. But I don't propose to go into those myself right now either [audience laughter]. Instead, I'm going to read, primarily from An Idiot Joy, but also from Black and Secret Man, which was an earlier book and also from one or two manuscript poems that I've been working on recently. I want to start with a poem called \\\"Signatures\\\" and although I can say a lot about a number of poems that I've written, I'm not sure I can say much about this except that as will be obvious to you I think, the imagery is drawn from the Vietnam [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q881] conflict, though I don't know that the poem is necessarily about that. Can you hear me with this mic? Some people at the back are saying 'no'. Can you hear me now?\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:07:00\\nReads \\\"Signatures\\\" [from An Idiot Joy].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:09:27\\nThis poem is called \\\"Neither Here Nor There\\\".\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:09:33\\nReads \\\"Neither Here Nor There\\\" [published later in Crusoe: Poems Selected and New].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:10:28\\nThis is a poem from Black and Secret Man and it's called \\\"The Direction is North Until the Pole\\\", and I suppose it's one of the few poems I've written that I would call a Canadian poem, that is to say it draws on a number of specific images from the Canadian landscape and therefore I have to annotate this poem. I have to tell you that the Fleming mentioned in the last line of the poem was once a Minister of Finance in the federal government, that just proves how transient political poems really are. I think all the rest of this should be clear, hockey is a game that's played in Canada [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q16].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:11:16\\nReads \\\"The Direction is North Until the Pole\\\" from Black and Secret Man.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:13:24\\nThis is one of my prophetic poems. I think I've written a lot of really prophetic poems. This poem is called \\\"Departure\\\" and it tells about leaving Edmonton. Everybody who has read the poem believes that I wrote it when I decided to leave Edmonton, either for the first time or the second time, I've left there twice, as a matter of fact, I didn't write it when I decided to leave in Edmonton, I wrote it when I arrived in Edmonton.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:13:53\\nReads \\\"Departure\\\" [from Black and Secret Man].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:14:37\\nA little poem about one of my perversions, this is about making love to pregnant women, I think, I'm not sure if there's a technical name for that but the perversion appears in the poem. The poem's called \\\"Cassandra\\\" and it's about a prophetess, Cassandra [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q170779], you'll remember was the woman that Agamemnon [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q128176]  brought home with him to his wife, Clytemnestra [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q131157], and this, so angered Clytemnestra, aside from the fact that Agamemnon had killed one of their daughters, that she killed Agamemnon, but Cassandra was a Prophetess, like Prophetesses, was given the power to tell the truth and was never believed. Some of the imagery in this poem is taken from the story of Cassandra, and the rest from my perversions.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:15:39\\nReads \\\"Cassandra\\\" [from Black and Secret Man].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:17:00\\nReads \\\"The Madness of our Polity\\\" [from An Idiot Joy].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:17:46\\n\\\"Whence Cometh Our Help?\\\", the title is taken from the Psalms [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q41064], and there are a number of images of the Psalms, in the poem. Or images from the Psalms.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:18:04\\nReads \\\"Whence Cometh Our Help?\\\" [from An Idiot Joy].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:19:03\\nThis poem is called \\\"Manner of Suicide\\\", and it's the closest thing I've come to writing a found poem, in that all the material in the poem, the words are taken from two sources, except for the first line. One is Karl Menninger's [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q3080926] Man Against Himself and the other, the Jewish Daily Prayer Book. There are twenty-six ways listed here of committing suicide, they're all ways that Menninger lists and documents, and he lists them in the order in which I give them here, and this list, which I give, is then followed by some comments he makes about those ways of committing suicide and a passage from the prayer book.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:20:11\\nReads \\\"Manner of Suicide\\\" [from An Idiot Joy].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:23:24\\nIn An Idiot Joy I wrote a number of poems which were, which used two primary images, the image of the moon and the image of the sea, and these are love poems. I suppose the interesting thing in them to me, aside from the personal sense that I feel about them, is that with each of the poems, whether it's with the image of the moon or the image of the sea, or both, I keep trying different technical things in the poetry, and so far as I'm concerned, I've done some more interesting technical things in this than anywhere else, but primarily, the poems talk about the moon and the sea, and seabirds and women and a woman.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:24:30\\nReads \\\"Woman in the Moon\\\" from An Idiot Joy.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:26:12\\nReads \\\"The Explanations of the Moon” [from An Idiot Joy].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:27:32\\nThis is one of the sea poems, in the sequence, called \\\"Listen, the Sea\\\", and the title comes from King Lear [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q181598], though actually, I had become aware of it of course when I knew that Keats [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q82083] had written a sonnet using this, but the technique is neither Shakespearean nor Keatsean, nothing of the kind.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:28:00\\nReads \\\"Listen, the Sea\\\" [from An Idiot Joy].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:29:01\\nAnd \\\"Marina\\\", who is a daughter of the sea.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:29:09\\nReads \\\"Marina\\\" [from An Idiot Joy].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:30:46\\nWell something quite different. I think I should dedicate this to George Bowering, because I wrote the poem after I had been…\\n\\nUnknown\\n00:30:56\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n\\nEli Mandel\\n00:30:57\\nAnd I would have to apologize for this, but the last thing in the world that I wanted to do was apologize, I'd prefer anything but that, I mean this is pretty simple-minded simplistic psychology, of the worst order I suppose, I just--I'm writing a poem about how stupid I felt at that particular moment.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:31:17\\nReads \\\"The Apology\\\" [from An Idiot Joy].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:34:34\\nThis is the poem I like to think of as the one that one would put in a time capsule, it's called \\\"Letter to be Opened Later\\\" and presumably each one of us wants to immortalize oneself, and imagine, you know, two thousand years later the time capsule being opened and then they can read your letter. This is my letter, to be opened later.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:35:12\\nReads \\\"Letter to be Opened Later\\\" [published later in Crusoe: Poems Selected and New ].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:36:09\\nI'm going to read a lyric, it's a very short poem, but I'd like to read this one anyhow. It's called \\\"To My Children\\\" and it's based upon both an odd and rather terrifying coincidence in my life and a curious Jewish tradition. The Jewish tradition is that you name a child after the nearest dead relative, the relative who has died most recently and who is closest to one, and it so happened that my mother died, my daughter was born, my father died and my son was born. And I wrote this poem about the naming of the children. It's called \\\"To My Children\\\".\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:37:08\\nReads \\\"To My Children\\\" [from Black and Secret Man].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:38:00\\nNow I'm going to finish this reading with two poems, one is called \\\"The Meaning of the I Ching\\\" and the other \\\"Cosmos: the Giant Rose\\\"--three poems, I'm sorry. I'm going to read \\\"Pictures in an Institution\\\" as well. \\\"The Meaning of the I Ching\\\", the I Ching [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q181937] as you probably know is a book of divination, it's the oldest book of divination known, and when I first heard about it, I looked at the book before I opened it and I wondered about the very simple notion of a book that old telling my future. How could I be contained in this ancient book? And I wrote this poem. Now it seems to me that there is something remarkable here, it's one claim I will make for the poem, at least, in the poem, is the first time I used the phrase \\\"earth upon earth\\\" and the very first hexagram that I cast when I opened the book. The book tells fortunes with what are called hexagrams and hexagrams are given various names, the very first one that I cast was the hexagram \\\"earth upon earth\\\" and that's simply something that happened whether it means that the poem is prophetic or magical, I don't know.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:39:36\\nReads \\\"The Meaning of the I Ching\\\" [from An Idiot Joy].\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:43:18\\nI'm going to finish now reading \\\"Pictures in an Institution\\\". This is the most personal poem I've ever written, and I don't want to read anything after that, so I'm going to finish with this. \\\"Pictures in an Institution\\\". I think all I need to say about this is that it plays off notices against some personal experiences and I think that'll be plain enough.\\n \\nEli Mandel\\n00:43:43\\nReads \\\"Pictures in an Institution\\\" [from Trio: First Poems by Gael Turnbull, Phyllis Webb, and Eli Mandel].\\n\\nEli Mandel\\n00:47:40\\nThank you.\\n\\nAudience\\n00:47:41\\nApplause.\\n\\nUnknown\\n00:47:51\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n\\nUnknown\\n00:47:53\\nAmbient Sound [voices].\\n\\nGeorge Bowering\\n00:48:22\\nI'd like to help you welcome now, D.G. Jones.\\n \\nAudience\\n00:48:27\\nApplause.\\n\\nD.G. Jones\\n00:48:60\\nI'm going to do this because I'm thirsty. It's a little disturbing but I've had a suspicion that this was becoming true for some time, in the last few years, that pretty soon you won't be able to tell the Jew from the Wasp, anyway [audience laughter]. It's getting more disconcerting all the time how similar certain things are between me and Eli Mandel [audience laughter]. I just hope he's a very good person and lives a long life and has great success in the future [audience laughter]. The main thing I want to read tonight is a little bit like Eli's last poem [audience laughter]. But it takes a lot more time to get itself said, for good or ill, and I'd like to read a few, a couple shorter poems anyway, before starting that longer poem which takes up a fair amount of the time. I'll read the first book from the, I mean...[laughter], I'll read the first poem from the book which old oriental George Bowering told you about at the beginning of the program. This poem's called \\\"The Perishing Bird\\\".\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:51:12\\nReads \\\"The Perishing Bird\\\" [from Phrases from Orpheus].\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:53:16\\nA poem called \\\"Summer is a Poem by Ovid\\\".\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:53:34\\nReads \\\"Summer is a Poem by Ovid\\\" [from Phrases from Orpheus].\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:54:41\\nWell, this reads well. It starts with a Latin title, it's a kind of letter, actually written in reply to a letter to somebody who accused me of being rather complacent when ironically enough, I felt anything but that at that time. Accused me of being one of the people who didn't have any troubles in life, or not only me but somebody else too, when we had quite a few of our own that were not too dissimilar from those that the other person was talking about. It's about marriage. It's called, to avoid looking too obvious, \\\"De Profundis Conjugii Vox et Responsum''. It's a serious poem though, more or less.\\n \\nD.G. Jones\\n00:55:56\\nReads \\\"De Profundis Conjugii Vox et Responsum\\\" [from Phrases from Orpheus].\\n \\nEND\\n01:01:57\\n\",\"notes\":\"Eli Mandel reads from An Idiot Joy (Hurtig, 1967), Black and Secret Man (1964), Trio:  First Poems (Contact Press, 1954), as well as poems later published in Crusoe: Poems Selected and New (Anansi, 1973).\\n\\n00:00- George Bowering introduces Eli Mandel and D.G. Jones [INDEX: announces other event: Ira Cohen film showing. Poetry 62 ed. by Eli Mandel and Jean-Guy Pilon: contains long poem by D.G. Jones, Contact Press, D.G. Jones- “Ontario Wasp Poet”/ Eli Mandel-“Western Jewish Poet”, Eli Mandel: An Idiot Joy published by Hurtig press, won Governor General Award, Eli Mandel: Black and Secret Man, D.G. Jones: Phrases from Orpheus Oxford Press]\\n05:08- Eli Mandel introduces “Signatures”\\n07:00- Reads “Signatures”\\n09:27- Reads “Neither Here Nor There”\\n10:28- Introduces “The Direction is North Until the Pole” [INDEX: Canadian Landscapes, Fleming- Minister of Finance of Federal Government, Political poems]\\n11:16- Reads “The Direction is North Until the Pole”\\n13:24- Introduces “Departure” [INDEX: leaving Edmonton]\\n13:53- Reads “Departure”\\n14:37- Introduces “Cassandra” [INDEX:  Cassandra, Prophetess, Clytemnestra, Agamemnon]\\n15:39- Reads “Cassandra”\\n17:00- Reads “The Madness of our Polity”\\n17:46- Introduces “Whence Cometh Our Help” [INDEX: psalms]\\n18:04- Reads “Whence Cometh Our Help”\\n19:03- Introduces “Manner of Suicide” [INDEX:  Karl Mennenger’s Man Against Himself,   Jewish Daily Prayer Book, Found Poem]\\n20:11- Reads “Manner of Suicide”\\n23:24- Introduces “Woman in the Moon” [INDEX: image: moon and sea]\\n24:30- Reads “Woman in the Moon”\\n26:12- Reads “The Explanations of the Moon”\\n27:32- Introduces “Listen, the Sea” [INDEX: King Lear, Keats Sonnet]\\n28:00- Reads “Listen, the Sea”\\n29:01- Reads “Marina”\\n30:46- Introduces “The Apology” [INDEX: George Bowering]\\n31:17- Reads “The Apology”\\n34:34- Introduces “Letter to be Opened Later” [INDEX: time capsule]\\n35:12- Reads “Letter to be Opened Later”\\n36:09- Introduces “To My Children” [INDEX: lyric poetry, Jewish naming tradition]\\n37:08- Reads “To My Children”\\n38:00- Introduces “The Meaning of the I Ching” [INDEX: hexagram ‘earth upon earth’]\\n39:36- Reads “The Meaning of the I Ching”\\n43:18- Introduces “Pictures in an Institution”\\n43:43- Reads “Pictures in an Institution”\\n47:47- George Bowering introduces D.G. Jones\\n48:35- D.G. Jones introduces “The Perishing Bird”\\n51:12- Reads “The Perishing Bird”\\n53:16- Reads “Summer is a Poem by Auden”\\n54:41- Introduces “De Profundis Con Yugie Voxette Responsem”\\n55:56- Reads “De Profundis Con Yugie Voxette Responsem”\\n01:01:57.14- END OF RECORDING\\n\\nFrom the Howard Fink list of Poems:\\n7/2/69\\none 5” reel, 3 3/4 one track, mono, 1/2 hour\\nreadings are from Mandel’s books An Idiot Joy and Black and Secret Man\\n\\n1. “Signature”\\n2. “Neither Here Nor There”\\n3. “The Direction is North Until the Pole”\\n4. “Departure”\\n5. “Cassandra”\\n6. first line “Being savages, we learn”\\n7. “Whence Cometh Our Help”\\n8. “Manner of Suicide”\\n9. “Woman on the Moon”\\n10. “The Explanation of the Moon”\\n11. “Listen, the Sea”\\n12. “Marina”\\n*note: list of poems not complete.\",\"title\":\"\",\"credit\":\"\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Sound Recording\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/sgw-poetry-readings/eli-mandel-at-sgwu-1969-d-g-jones-george-bowering/\"}]"],"score":2.9979138},{"id":"1278","cataloger_name":["Masoumeh,Zaare"],"partnerInstitution":["Concordia University"],"collection_source_collection":["SGWU Reading Series-Concordia University Department of English fonds"],"source_collection_label":["SGWU Reading Series-Concordia University Department of English fonds"],"collection_contributing_unit":["Records Management and Archives"],"source_collection_uri":[""],"collection_image_url":[""],"collection_source_collection_description":["The fonds consists of some administrative records of the SGWU Department of English and the Concordia Department of English between 1971 and 2000. It also consists of some SGWU Department of English records related to student academic activities in the 1940s and to public readings and lectures, and a few interviews, produced between 1966 and 1972. The fonds mainly includes minutes of departmental meetings and some course timetables. It also includes some student papers in bound volumes and 63 sound recordings (80 audio reels) mainly composed of poetry readings (see the Concordia SpokenWeb project which uses this material) but also a few lectures given at SGWU. There are also loose typed sheets describing some of the SGWU poetry readings."],"collection_source_collection_id":["I086"],"persistent_url":["http://archives.concordia.ca/I086"],"item_title":["Robert Duncan at Sir George Williams University, The Poetry Series, 19 April 1969"],"item_title_source":["Cataloguer"],"item_title_note":["\"ROBERT DUNCAN -1 Recorded Spring 1970 3.75 ips, 1/2 track on 1 mil. tape ONE OF TWO TAPES\" written on sticker on the back of the tape's box. \"ROBERT DUNCAN -1 I006/SR96.1\" written on sticker on the spine of the tape's box. I006-11-096.1 written on sticker on the reel.\n\n\"ROBERT DUNCAN -2 Recorded, Spring, 1970 3.75 ips, 1/2 track on 1 mil. tape THE SECOND OF TWO TAPES\" written on sticker on the back of the tape's box. \"ROBERT DUNCAN -2 I006/SR96.2\" written on sticker on the spine of the tape's box."],"item_language":["English"],"item_production_context":["Documentary recording"],"item_series_title":["The Poetry Series"],"item_subseries_title":["Poetry 3"],"item_identifiers":["[I006-11-096.1 , I006-11-096.2]"],"creator_names":["Duncan, Robert"],"creator_names_search":["Duncan, Robert"],"creators":["[{\"url\":\" http://viaf.org/viaf/105142281\",\"name\":\"Duncan, Robert\",\"dates\":\"1919-1988\",\"notes\":\"American poet Robert Duncan was born on January 7, 1919 in Oakland, California. At birth, he was given his father’s name: Edward Howard Duncan. In 1920 and after his mother’s death shortly after childbirth, Duncan was adopted into another family and re-named. But he adopted the name Robert Duncan when he started publishing his early poems. These poems were published in magazines during his studies at University of California at Berkeley between 1936-1938. He edited the Experimental Review the year following. Duncan then moved to New York where he joined a group of writers which included Anais Nin, George Barker, Henry Miller, and Kenneth Patchen. The poems that he wrote in this period were collected in 1966 for The Years as Catches: First Poems 1939-1946 (Oyez Press) and in 1968 for The First Decade: Selected Poems 1940-1950 (Fulcrum Press). From 1946 to 1950, Duncan moved to San Francisco, where he met and was influenced by poet Jack Spicer. His first collection of published poems was Heavenly and Earthly City (Bern Porter Press, 1947), followed by Poems 1948-49 (Berkeley Miscellany Editions, 1949). In 1948 he enrolled in classes in Medieval and Renaissance Civilization, taught by Ernst Kantorowicz, after which he published Medieval Scenes (Centaur Press) in 1950. The next year he met and began a lifelong relationship with the painter Jess Collins, and by 1955 he published Caesar’s Gate Poems 1949-1950 with Collages by Jess (Divers Press), a collection of poems from the early 50’s. Fragments of a Disordered Devotion was published privately in 1952, only to be re-printed by Toronto’s Island Press in 1966. During this time he also was deeply influenced by the poems of Charles Olson, Robert Creeley and Denise Levertov. Duncan taught at the Black Mountain College in 1956, and published Derivations (1968), poems collected from 1950 to 1956. After spending a year in Mallorca, his play Medea at Kolchis: The Maiden Head was performed at Black Mountain College. Duncan then moved back to San Francisco as the assistant director of the Poetry Center at San Francisco State University.  His most popular collection of poems, The Opening of the Field (Grove Press) was published in 1960, and was re-printed in London by Jonathan Cape in 1969 and in New York by New Directions in 1973. He was associated with the Creative Writing Workshop at the University of British Columbia in 1963, and he held a Guggenheim Fellowship until 1964. Duncan became one of the most vocal poets writing against the Vietnam war, and some of his anti-war poetry was published in pamphlets, collected later in Ground Work: Before the War printed privately in 1971. His later collections include, but are not limited to Roots and Branches, (Scribners, 1964, reprinted by New Directions, 1968, and Johnathan Cape, 1970), Bending the Bow (New Directions, 1968), his last collection of poetry, Ground Work II: In the Dark (New Directions, 1987), and several books of essays including Fictive Certainties (New Directions, 1985). He was the recipient of National Endowment of the Arts grants, the National Poetry Award as well as other honours. Robert Duncan died in 1988, and several of his collections of poetry were published posthumously.\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Author\",\"Performer\"]}]"],"contributors_names":["Bowering, George"],"contributors_names_search":["Bowering, George"],"contributors":["[{\"url\":\"http://viaf.org/viaf/34469976\",\"name\":\"Bowering, George\",\"dates\":\" 1935-\",\"notes\":\"\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Series organizer\",\"Presenter\"]}]"],"Presenter_name":["Bowering, George"],"Series_organizer_name":["Bowering, George"],"Performance_Date":[1969],"material_description":["[{\"side\":\"\",\"image\":\"\",\"other\":\"\",\"extent\":\"1/4 inch\",\"AV_types\":\"Audio\",\"tape_brand\":\"Scotch\",\"generations\":\"\",\"Conservation\":\"\",\"equalization\":\"\",\"playback_mode\":\"Mono\",\"playing_speed\":\"3 3/4 ips\",\"sound_quality\":\"Good\",\"recording_type\":\"Analogue\",\"storage_capacity\":\"\",\"physical_condition\":\"\",\"track_configuration\":\"Half-track\",\"material_designation\":\"Reel to Reel\",\"physical_composition\":\"Magnetic Tape\",\"accompanying_material\":\"\",\"other_physical_description\":\"\"},{\"side\":\"\",\"image\":\"\",\"other\":\"Box is Scotch brand, tape is BASF\",\"extent\":\"1/4 inch\",\"AV_types\":\"Audio\",\"tape_brand\":\"BASF\",\"generations\":\"\",\"Conservation\":\"\",\"equalization\":\"\",\"playback_mode\":\"Mono\",\"playing_speed\":\"3 3/4 ips\",\"sound_quality\":\"Good\",\"recording_type\":\"Analogue\",\"storage_capacity\":\"\",\"physical_condition\":\"\",\"track_configuration\":\"Half-track\",\"material_designation\":\"Reel to Reel\",\"physical_composition\":\"Magnetic Tape\",\"accompanying_material\":\"\",\"other_physical_description\":\"\"}]"],"material_designations":["Reel to Reel","Reel to Reel"],"physical_compositions":["Magnetic Tape","Magnetic Tape"],"recording_type":["Analogue","Analogue"],"AV_type":["Audio","Audio"],"playback_mode":["Mono","Mono"],"Dates":["[{\"date\":\"1969 4 19\",\"type\":\"Performance Date\",\"notes\":\"Please note that the Howard Fink list states the reading took place in “Spring 1970”, while the interview states another (perhaps separate) reading took place on April 19, 1969.\",\"source\":\"Previous researcher\"}]"],"Location":["[{\"url\":\"https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/22080570\",\"venue\":\"Hall Building\",\"notes\":\"Exact venue location unknown\",\"address\":\"1455, Boul de Maisonneuve Ouest, Montreal, Quebec, Canada\",\"latitude\":\" 45.4972758\",\"longitude\":\" -73.57893043\"}]"],"Address":["1455, Boul de Maisonneuve Ouest, Montreal, Quebec, Canada"],"Venue":["Hall Building"],"City":["Montreal, Quebec"],"content_notes":["Robert Duncan reads from The Opening of the Field (Grove Press, 1960), Roots and Branches (New Directions, 1964), and Bending the Bow (New Directions, 1968)."],"contents":["robert_duncan_i006-11-096-1.mp3 [File 1 of 2] \n \nGeorge Bowering\n00:00:00\n...say anything about Robert Duncan's credentials, so I'll make this as brief as possible. M.L. Rosenthal [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6723336] said, a little while ago in the Reporter that Duncan [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q57421163] was the best of the poets in the experimental tradition and Warren Tolman says he's the best poet writing in the English Language, and I'd probably go further than that. And it's the reading we've been waiting for, most of us, all year, so I'd like to give him as much time as there possibly is. Robert Duncan.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:00:44\nIn the early 50's, I belonged to a, not a group, because as a matter of fact we were scattered, some in Europe and some in America and didn't know each other, but we were all reacting to a, we all had response of a feeling of poetic responsibility and also a poetic mission, arising out of our response to the publication of Ezra Pound's [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q163366] \"Pisan Cantos\" [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q2701465] and the publication that came year after year of the parts of William Carlos Williams's [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q178106] \"Paterson\" [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q7017378] but in the same period in magazines, some of the poetry of the later William Carlos Williams was appearing. And it does interest me, although the command of the Modernists had been to write in a natural speech, that in response to features that were appearing in Williams more than Pound, because Pound's lines are all syntactic utterances, but in Williams there's a kind of enjambment and there was a juncture appearing at the end of lines. And we, we took that juncture over and imposed it upon the language, but even in imposing it, found that we had arrived at something that's quite common indeed in our English speech, the stutter is at one end of it, but it is one of the forms we have when we are emotionally excited and things are broken up into phrases and words become almost painful and impossible to say, and this encounter we explored for some time. Later, I'm going to be reading, in passages, which will bring into question radically something related to his. My poetry developed along lines that I began to see as allied to the collage, things that were appearing in American painting, that is whole elements and bits would be taken from anywhere, and very early, at the time, as a matter of fact that I was writing The Opening of the Field, I viewed myself as a kind of jackdaw of poetry and gave up entirely worrying about if I had any originality or had a voice of my own. I was much more attracted picking up things and building them into something, so I was a weaver, I felt in some ways, almost before I was a speaker, and I was a weaver of voices and did not care, or- I decided well, I happen to be the one who is doing this, so certainly that's one thing that I don't have to have an effort about. There's nothing else that's going to be moving out from here. In passages, you'll find a new feature about that collage, but it's already contained in the thing I was suggesting that we took over- the juncture, Creeley [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q918620] for instance built a whole personal style from that juncture and by making its articulation radical, and forcing it into a depth of an emotional statement, and of course of an intellectual statement, because the whole framework of thought changes. Very striking to us in the very beginning was that form was the content, not, it was very hard to determine it, you could say that it even determined content, there was no cause to effect relationship for us, between form and content. Structure determined the nature of what was to thought, like the structure of a body is to what we are, and we didn't think of them as divided, so we were incarnationists in that sense. I feel very strongly that you'll find that repeatedly a theme of my poetry the incarnation of Christ [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q302], the incarnation of spirit and the body, that spirit, that the divine world is manifest and incarnate, and that in its- led us back to the poem as the incarnation and place in which- the spirit doesn't enter poetry, incarnate, it exists. But it was also a collage and you will hear Greek and French entering this world of a collage, and it will be as reformed as the American language is when it enters my collage. And reformed to American contours, the contours of French, and the contours of Greek disappear, forced back into an American stress system, which I find analogous. The French poets were extremely disturbed when Stravinsky set them, she could not bear to hear [Persephone (?)] and because they all came out, French all came out to be Russian in its entire tonation and the French not very happy when the French language turns up in an intonation. I'm thinking of the Parisian, but no Frenchman's very happy about the French language turning up, turning out to be American or Russian. Now my poetry doesn't turn out to be exactly American either, it turns out to be strictly forced back to conform to my poetic patterns, and Greek is not intoned but is forced into a stress pattern. However, with Greek I'm in for free because there's no man who can say what you do with it anyway. In America, we have one system, in Germany, they have another system, and in England, they have, still, a third system of what to do with vowels and what to do with the whole thing. And there's a controversy about whether you do have pitch or whether you do have stress and that arises from the fact that the Hellenistic Greeks [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q428995] already couldn't figure out exactly what you did with those Greek choruses, and they had to put those marks in to instruct their readers what to do, and we don't know what those marks meant for sure [audience laughter]. But they certainly didn't know what it had been like 500 years before. They did poorer, I take it, than the poorest, and that would include me, informed of us do with Middle English [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q36395], and I guess we're nearer to it than they were. Okay, well, we'll just start out and I want to take a path, I'm going to take a path through beginning with a small group of poems from The Opening of the Field.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:07:46\nReads \"The Law I Love is Major Mover” from The Opening of the Field.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:10:44\nWhen I was about 30, a great Medieval Historian was teaching at the University of California [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q184478], where I made my living teaching, typing thesis and term papers when I was really hard out of luck and the rumour was very thick indeed that something extraordinary had happened, I think, and my impression is that Universities kill off scholars today much faster than they- they certainly don't kill off poets, they give them very handsome fees to come for a week or so, but they certainly kill off scholars, but the existence- perhaps only the World War with its refugee professors from Europe brought this kind of scholarship onto the scene at the University of California and I returned to school to take up Medieval Studies. One of the, clearly, in my work I, the one course, and I studied with that man until he left for the Princeton Institute of Advanced Learning, studied for him--with him for two and a half years, the course that most changed my poetry was a course on Medieval law, and the growth of constitutional law, because the very basis of poetry I think is a- of art, is the discovery of laws, the laws that finally we can trace through from those Medieval concepts of law and constant meditations upon law so I'm going to read a couple of more poems of our- in which this concept of law moves. This is \"Structure of Rime XIII\" and it's part of an open construct that is a construct that has nothing in its concept, does not belong to a world of cause or effect. It has a chronology, but its chronology is like our chronological time, that is seen by contemporary physics as an anomaly within a time--within a physical time that cannot possibly have the character of a chronological sequence. The best they can explain is that we must inhabit a thread that is suspended in actual time, because actual physical time cannot really be one directional, and we experience one directional time because we are really caught in some isolated thread, in the medium of time. So in \"Structure of Rime\" I conceive of myself not in a chronology, although I experience it, being human as such, but as entering such a domain in which real law exists and real time exists, and the real form to which the poem refers and from which it derives its form. The real form has no beginning or end, and is much faster, is universal, so the--in writing the poem I do not create a form, but participate in a form which is of the nature that we believe the physical world to be and I am much for a convert of Whitehead's process and reality in which we believe the spiritual world to be. And that's where \"The Structure of Rime\" takes place. When I say 'thirteen',  that's of course, in my own sequence then and I conceive of that sequence as actually existing in a part of the mosaic that does not have the character of sequence.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:14:29\nReads \"Structure of Rime XIII\" from The Opening of the Field. \n \nRobert Duncan\n00:16:59\nSome time shortly after The Opening of the Field was published, I was invited up to Portland [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6106] by a lawyer and his wife to talk to a small group and I learned in correspondence that he had been attracted to my poetry because of the concepts of law as they move through poems, and so I wrote, for them, the poem called \"The Law\", a series and variation.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:17:35\nReads \"The Law\" [from Roots and Branches].\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:23:27\nWhen Adams [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q11806] said, “the which”, meaning, he said, \"Democracy, the which requires the continual exercise of virtue beyond the reach of human infirmity, even in its best estate\" he was writing to Jefferson and talking about something that was absolutely necessary, he did not mean that we could escape from what required what was impossible. We had to live in the impossible, which is where I found myself entirely in concord with certainly a poet understands what it is to live in the impossible. He speaks in the first place in a voice which is impossible for himself to speak in, and before which he must always be a flunk out and in some sense, a political- a poetical failure in relation to what everywhere's own poetics is to point out what is necessary. Let me in relation to the law again, read the opening of a poem that I will be later be reading entire, but I want to bring it in context with these poems and the law, and close it with a John Adams that I discovered only a passage of John Adams that I discovered for myself, only about what, it's two or three years ago, two years ago. \"Reading on Myth\", this was from a book called I think it's called 18th Century Against the Gods, or confronts--The 18th Century Confronts the Gods and the chapter on John Adams's mythology was a fascinating chapter, and this passage of the poem is built up entirely with no interpolations at all of--it's built up to the place where I cease to read it, with no interpolations at all of passages of the marginalia that John Adams writes in an Encyclopedia of Mythology.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:25:32\nReads [\"John Adams’s Marginalia...\"].\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:26:53\nMove back to another early poem in The Opening of the Field that was formative to, throughout my work and the last I guess it must be, each one of these is about three, this is the last ten years. The Field began in 1956, so it must be the last 14 years. And this poem is written in 1956. Take my coat off. In articulating the line, we were opening up- Pound had very early said [unintelligible] by the musical phrase and as I said, since his phrases were identical with syntactic utterances, with sentence utterances, the phrase is- the phrase is simpler than the phrases we use, where often they are enjambed, where often they disturb the meaning of the sentence and suspend elements so that they operate in various parts we did not want what was called an ambiguity by Mr. [Adams (?)], we wanted a multi-phasic area of meanings which is something very different. We wanted all parts to operate within all other parts. And I think this is a crucial difference from what let's say fascinated the metaphysicals of the post-Eliot [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q37767] period in their idea of ambiguities. We wanted one meaning operating within another meaning and they wanted one meaning secretly giving another meaning, I may have such things too, but I mean it's a very different feeling for us. Certainly they did not have to come to articulate as we did, and with these poems, when I get to, as you'll see in passages, when I get into rhythmic articulations where only my body is intelligent enough to keep them, so I have to throw them back into my hands and to my body, a dance can carry them and a dance is really in a sense, the poem in which I moved straight forward and realized how un-literary this was and not exactly song either, and that this dance centre was going to be for whole sections of poems. So, there's a key poem.\n\nRobert Duncan\n00:29:27\nReads \"The Dance\" [from The Opening of the Field].\n\nUnknown\n00:31:32\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed]. \n\nRobert Duncan\n00:31:33\nResumes reading \"The Dance\" [from The Opening of the Field].\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:32:09.\nSomeone said this evening I probably wouldn't read The Pindar poems, I will. Oh let me sing a song for you, songs, I have a couple of songs that are in books. Songs for me are not that quaint form that, a few of them are like the night nurse's songs, the song the night nurse sang. But a song of the old order and some of the other songs are actual songs, that means when I was writing them, a tune came. And they had only one voice to be in, mine, and we could even say unhappily, but there they were. And startled I was when, this is I think, one of the first songs that came that really belonged in a book of poetry. I had early had some songs in Faust Foutu in a sort of a long play that would never get performed in my mind so I was able to whatever I wanted to in it, and- which is a great kind of play to write, because you don't have to worry about anyone else solving any problems, you can name it, they can be on the moon, or whatever, have no stage dimension problems, but also of course I had no song dimension problems but when I wrote this song, \"Gee, I know I'm going to have to get up and sing it\", well of course now you'll get away with it because how rare you'd hear a poet's voice, unless a poet's already like your happy rock-n-roll singer, which I ain't as you will hear. My idea of song is exceedingly primitive indeed, my impression is very, I think you will hear it in this song, it comes from a brief period in which to much the horror of my theosophical parents, but because we were living in a small town and all your friends went to a Sunday School, I went for several years to a Methodist Sunday school and somebody along the line gave me the hint that hymns would come out much better if I just moved my mouth and didn't join in, happily, the lovely music that was going on and so of course I always wanted to write a hymn and there's something in the Methodist hymnal for sure in the song I'm going to sing. \"A Song of the Old Order\". It's not strictly Methodist in theology, but I meant that it's something of the Methodist hymn. However, I will sing also, by following another song that is certainly Calvinist [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q101849], it's a Halloween song, and like only the scotch can possibly dig out of there- the Calvinist counter hymnal.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:34:52\nSings \"A Song of the Old Order\" [from The Opening of the Field].\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:38:05\nThat was considerably higher than I've ever tried to do it before. [Audience laughter]. But, like a poem, when you're writing it, when you're in it, you're in for it. You can't re-model it to something you think you might get through with. So I will now do the Pindar poem. That somewhat determines what long poem we're going to do. And since this is the first time I've read here in Montreal, some other places I read, I try and give them new stuff, but I take it outside of some tapes that might be available, you haven't really heard these poems. And this will be the last one from The Opening of the Field. I'll pick up a couple from Roots and Branches and then I will be reading from the current, the Bending the Bow and then after the break I'll read some of the new poems that I've written since Bending the Bow. [Take off Biney's Law (?).] No, this is not the beginning of a Ginsberg [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6711] round [laughter.] \"Beginning with a Line by Pindar\", I am ending up with an exhibition by Ginsberg, [laughter.] We've gotten so [unintelligible] in San Francisco [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q62] since all barriers of all kinds were down you really couldn't compete with the show, so you've got, I mean what to do. Common, ordinary people are just left out, you've got to be somebody extraordinary now to [audience laughter], and poetry has to be my extraordinary thing. Believe me, the rest of me is just me. \"A Poem Beginning with a Line by Pindar\".\n\nRobert Duncan\n00:40:17\nReads \"A Poem Beginning with a Line by Pindar\" [from The Opening of the Field].\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:54:15\nI'll read two poems from--that were requested from Roots and Branches.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:54:30\nReads [\"Risk”] from Roots and Branches.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:59:22\nThe other poem I will read from Roots and Branches is \"The Continent\". My poetic thought continuously arises from the ground of my happy and, believe me, wildly misunderstanding readings of contemporary science. And the one real poetic source I have is not a literary magazine but Scientific American [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q39379] which I avidly read. So I'm more likely to be studying language than I am to be studying poems and more likely to be studying the world, than I am to be- well, I can't say that, language and the world get even treatment. The poem \"The Continent\" came from the re-assertion that has come in recent years of evidence which has rebuilt the picture of the continental drift. And I was happy at the coordinates to find that Charles Olson [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q922978], who also ransacks the same magazine, but does not have the same misunderstandings of the magazine by any means, we have quite a, we sometimes come to [loggerheads (?) ] in our very positively taken misunderstandings of what is. He also had built sections of “Maximus [Poems]” on the continental drift. I love puns of course right away, and so does he, and if you get my drift in poetry, you will see something of what is revealed when we begin to get the drift of those continents and the fittingness of poetry is of course the logic whereby we identify that the continents originally fitted together and identified the sequence of things that happened. They do fit together, but they must have- I mean, the universe- the Neo-plateness, [unintelligible], well no, it isn't a neo-plate, well, it's a near neo-plate, and it's [unintelligible] Judas [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q81018] refers to the masterpiece which is the Universe, that's the only masterpiece and the rest of us compose masterpieces because we are children of the universe, although we may not recognize that that's what we are doing. Some of us don't have entire respect for what we belong to. \"The Continent\".\n \nRobert Duncan\n01:01:49\nReads \"The Continent\" from Roots and Branches.\n \nUnknown\n01:03:39\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n\nRobert Duncan\n01:03:40\nResumes reading \"The Continent\" from Roots and Branches.\n\nRobert Duncan\n01:06:16\n[Unintelligible] break in tone I'll sing that song I mentioned, the second one that comes from a Calvinist anti-hymnal. It's a song from my Halloween masque. And it's “A Country Wife’s Song”, the country husband is lying in bed, snoring away and the wife rises silently, puts a stick in the bed and a stone on the pillow and sings the following song.\n \nRobert Duncan\n01:07:50\nPerforms “A Country Wife’s Song” [from Roots and Branches].\n \nRobert Duncan\n01:09:38\nWe seem to be close to 10:30 so I'm going to just--I won't read--well, I'd like to read one passage before the intermission and I would also like to read the poem \"Epilogos\", then we'll have a break, I would suggest about 10 minutes and I will then read in the second part, I will be reading from \"Passages\", well let me add one more poem to this first part because I want to give you a sample of what I've been--so there will be one \"Passages\", so those of you with great relief run out into the world will at least have been subject to something of what \"Passages\" is like, and I will read \"Epilogos\" and then I will read one of the poems that I have written, post-Bending the Bow and then you will have a sample of everything and you won't be missing a thing if you don't stay for the second part. [Audience laughter]. Okay, well a few things, but you might be missing them anyway.\n \nRobert Duncan\n01:10:39\nReads \"Transgressing the Real, Passages 27\" [from Bending the Bow].\n \nRobert Duncan\n01:14:14\nReads \"Epilogos\" [from Bending the Bow].\n\nRobert Duncan\n01:20:57\nNow the one poem from, poetry I've written since then, a poem called \"Achilles' Song\". One note before I read it, the island that we would ordinarily in American call ‘Leuke’ a [unintelligible], like in Leukemia--leuke. In Greek would be ‘Lay-okay’ and so I was very alarmed indeed when in this poem, as I was writing it came out ‘Loy-kay’ and it took me quite some time of sheer stage fright and horror at the mis-pronunciation recall the ‘Lauke’ in German is the [unintelligible] and so forth in German, and that I have had for years now, for some years now a tape of H.D. [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q236469] reading from her \"Helen in Egypt\", a poem which is really the mother poem of this poem, and not too much hidden in the poem, for those who know of  my closeness to H.D. who was certainly a surrogate mother for me. Thetis of the poem would certainly be the poetess H.D. and in that tape, H.D. who had lived for most of her life from the 20's on in Switzerland, uses the German pronunciation throughout, ‘Aloike’ and that's how I heard it in association with this poem. So I've finally recognized where it came from but it's an example of the fact that you cannot correct things in poems because it's sewn into a rhyme and absolutely belongs in the music here. Play it differently--I mean, it's what fits a poem not what fits some other system outside the poem that the poem must adhere to. Okay, \"Achilles' Song\".\n \nRobert Duncan\n01:22:44 \nReads \"Achilles' Song\".\n\nUnknown\n01:25:05\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n\nAudience\n01:25:06\nApplause.\n\nRobert Duncan\n01:25:16\nSo we'll take a break of ten minutes and then I'm going to read a rather short section because we're almost at 11 and that would seem, I want to read as many, something like four passages to give you of a feeling of moving through that and that would give you something like Passages are like.\n\nUnknown\n01:25:44\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n\nRobert Duncan\n01:25:45\nTwo aspects of the art, seem particularly mysteries to me as I've been working at the art of poetry since I was 19 and it's now 30 years. In relation to that thing we call rhyme, meter and so forth, I have come to think more and more that it's ratios and numbers that may be the heart of the matter. And at the same time as I begin to feel that at the heart of the matter, as one begins to, as one does with mysteries, be fearful about approaching the question. Some years ago, two years ago or so, with the poet Zukofsky [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q975481], who knows much more than I do of the art, and performs really awesomely in it, I said it had begun, I said \"Zuk,” I said, “I had begun to feel that it isn't a question about syllables or stresses and so forth, it's a question of numbers\". And he said \"Yes, I've decided by now I ought to, certainly if I don't know syllables and stresses and so forth, by now, I mean know them only in my hand, I certainly shouldn't be thinking about them. And I am now only dealing with 8's. All of these lines are 8's, straight through. I have not yet really phased the initiations of the question of numbers but I know that this is central as one moves into the period of working in the art that I'm in.\" The other thing, and that is that I have indicated it earlier, is that the nature of the time of the art is increasingly mysterious, the one thing I'm sure of it cannot be, positive absolutely defined in one area, for a long time I was doing happily enough with the formula that Christians made for themselves of time and eternity and their term of eternity which is the very present moment of any work of art and is also of course somehow containing the ensemble of all of the things created must also be like that time that physics talks about. That makes them puzzle why in the world our own time goes from a thing we call the past to the future. Whitehead [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q183372] solves it in Process and Reality by suggesting that we create, in every moment that we live a past and a future, and we live in a history consequently because that's what we create what we are, is pastness and future, and sum it up in a material, that is still persuasive. But a mystery is when none of the answers are answers and as long as they're not answers the artist has them as really, forces that move as art. Now I make this remark because, well I said something about chronologies I, in the past I have not read these two poems as they appear in the book, in readings, but I want to read them today and I'm going to just underline the transition I want you to see and share with me at this point. I arranged, for all that what I've said about chronologies, I arranged the poems in my volumes chronologically and largely because it seems to me a mystery as they go and the rhymes appear from one to the other, and one poem will be an announcement of a succeeding poem or themes will flow out of it. The one I'm going to read first is not a “Passages\" it's called \"Reflections\" and at the close, and as a theme of it, you will find the old man, who is as a matter of fact, I structure rhyme preceding it had a fire master appearing, who seems very close indeed to the master of fire, and the poem that came next, it may have been in a couple of weeks of so, this was a very productive period, concludes with a figure of an old man tuning a drum between a bowl of fire and a bowl of water, and it was followed by a \"Passages\" which is called \"The Fire\", and from it we can learn that the fire that you see in \"Passages\" which is catastrophic, and is held in a polarity with an ideogram with the natural world, that that which may have indeed be--is indeed a bowl of water, as you will see, I mean it's a stream of water that the fire is composed between a world of water and its own world of fire, but that fire that looks like a catastrophe you will find is the creative fire--if you go under \"Reflections\" and let the reflections that came first reflect into the poem following. Now these are things that you realize afterwards, in your own chronology. I am one of those poets who has the characteristic I find in my study of Whitman [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q81438] in the last three years that Whitman certainly was another poet who studied himself all the time. We have a great prohibition in our contemporary world against studying yourself, but I am not short on the world of ego, so I'm not really very disturbed about the fact that I study myself in the poetry. But the one thing I search to find is not something we would ordinarily call ourselves, I study the poet, the thing that the poems are creating in order for them to come into being. That I can sharply distinguish from myself. As sharply as you can do it, it takes office, the idea of office, and this again I got from my Medieval Studies. Okay, I'm going to read \"Reflections\" and then I'm going to read \"The Fire\" and then I will, the poems I will be reading from then on will be \"Passages\", \"Fire\" is one of \"Passages\". And \"Passages\" is as I explained, an open form that exists in these other universe of time, of something, like, you call eternity.\n \nRobert Duncan\n01:32:07\nReads \"Reflections\" [from Bending the Bow].\n \nEND\n01:34:38\n\n\nrobert_duncan_i006-11-096-2.mp3 [File 2 of 2] \n\nRobert Duncan\n00:00:00\nReads [“The Fire, Passages 13 from Bending the Bow; recording begins abruptly].\n \nUnknown\n00:13:11\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed]. \n\nRobert Duncan\n00:13:12\n...beginning with a poem called \"Soldiers\", a poem in which, um, let's see, right, some lines of Victor Hugo [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q535] enter, I decided I should, well, I guess, lets see, no I don't want to read too late, and soldiers is rather long again, so I want- certain themes that are moving in \"Soldiers\" will reappear. In \"Soldiers\", a recurring line was one from a poem of Victor Hugo's, \"Dieu dans [unintelligible] reve\", which is a line really quite in tune with my own poetics, \"God, oh creator the- or the creator for us too in oneself whose dream, whose work goes much further than our dreams\" and so it's combined with a scene that's Vietnam and it's combined in the Soldiers with the theme of the recognition that in some mystery of that work that goes further than our dreams the soldiers in Vietnam most of them, have just there, and they're 19 or 18 and so forth, they have only there in which to make their lives. And they have only there in which to, to take their souls in the war, as the followers of Orpheus take soul in the poem. The wood to take fire from that dirty flame. A recognition that that is their field in which they must reach life's epiphany and its thing. And the line of Victor Hugo carried me forward to and returned me to grand themes of Victor Hugo's but it also took me back to Vietnam [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q881] and I wanted to give, before I read \"The Kao Dai\" a little sketch of that. There's a theme of Victor Hugo, by the way, of the fall of Lucifer [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q185498] in which, Lucifer's falling into his own denial of God and in falling he opens the univ- creation, and but in his falling a feather breaks loose from his wings and is floating mid-air, and the sight of God descending falls upon the feather and it becomes light and it turns into an angel and that angel is Liberty and that angel's entire message is to transform the rage and wrathful light that had fallen upon it into the reunion and resurrection of Satan, but of course both Satan and God must be called from their wrath, to reconciliation, so this angel, Liberty and Freedom is also the angel of reconciliation and Victor Hugo knew that also there must be some explanation for the fact that the desire and yearning for freedom and liberty has always been wrathful. Blake [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q41513] is puzzled by the same thing and I think that today, when all over the world, not only in Canada [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q16], but in the United States [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q30], and in China [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q29520], and Yugoslavia [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q36704] and Russia [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q159] the wrath of Liberty is rising and it is the wrath of God against the civilization to its very roots which we know in our hearts are Godless. But that wrath must be reconciled, because it is itself that it's rising against and there's some mystery in this, so my poetry has begun to take up the figure of that angel and the angel comes into it. Now, in Vietnam, one of the strongest forces in the Viet Cong, not a communist group but a religious group, the Cao Dai [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q470364] and in order to read more in deeper into the Cao Dai, I wisely, I think, went back to sources to the early thirties before Vietnam was quite the cause it is today, and found this story and it came quite in line with my kooky family and my own poetry because it was at a medium's table in 1925 on Christmas Eve, when Christ descended and speaking in French, as I usually put it when I read my, something worse than American French, a French man would feel that that was blasphemy, but I'm after all repeating Christ's words in his own voice so that might be more serious yet that that voice was being attempted. Christ came into the medium and renounced in my birth day for the spirit is descending upon Vietnam and when we remember what happened to the very first generation of Christians who were burned in rows as torches, what the promise of Christ meant to his immediate blessing, the powers of martyrdom. The promise of Christ in 1925 was amply fulfilled to his new disciples. So amply, as a matter of fact, the Cao Dai had more than come to my mind, because the cathedral town of Cao Dai, which is [unintelligible] indeed exactly like a Catholic nunnery or convent, or a Buddhist nunnery or convent is Communist, is the province of Tay Ninh [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q36608], and the Cathedral city of Tay Ninh, now it is been repeated over and over in American papers that when those planes were returning for missions in North Vietnam and hadn't dumped their missions, you're not supposed to return any bombs, you gotta dump them somewhere, so they'd dump them on Tay Ninh, you'd just go over the side and dump them on Tay Ninh, because this particular religious group was stubborn indeed in its inherences. Now, also interesting to me was this particular religious group had as its patron Saint Victor Hugo, and the first place that the French are, that the Vietnamese have French as their deepest religious and literary language and so Christ talked in French so Victor Hugo gave the whole line, it's Victor Hugo's Christ who talked to them at the medium tables in French, and they of course had their medium tables in the line of the tradition of Victor Hugo's own medium tables in the Isle of Jersey. So Victor Hugo becomes patron saint for these passages. In the passage, by the way, a passage called \"Orders\" and I will read a passage from it in which I am actually translating from Victor Hugo quite directly but it's a very long poem and keeping in tune with that master of the sublime is very difficult for us in the modern period. Here we are, the passage, wait a minute, it isn't in that poem, I always think it's in \"Orders\", but it's actually in place of a passage 22, that has the passage with Victor Hugo. I have been working on it for years, and it's mainly trying to keep in tune, I go over and over and over it again and then I find it very difficult to deal with 19th century poetry. But this is a passage straight translation, as literal as I could from Victor Hugo, but really, massive poem.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:21:11\nReads \"The Soldiers\" [from Bending the Bow].\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:22:14\nCharming little poem called the \"Twentieth Century\", in case you want to know where we are.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:22:22\nReads \"Twentieth Century\" [published as “The Light, Passages 28” in Bending the Bow].\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:30:27\nI'll close with \"Stage Directions\".\n \nUnknown\n00:30:32\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n\nRobert Duncan\n00:30:33\nReads [“Stage Directions, Passages 30” from Bending the Bow; begins mid-poem].\n \nAudience\n00:37:53\nApplause.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:38:12\nI'll add one more poem which has not been read aloud except at home today, this is one--I hope I've got the right note--this is a \"Structure of Rime\" that was composed on April Fool's day but it doesn't mean it isn't serious, I mean April 1st.\n \nRobert Duncan\n00:38:32\nReads \"Structure of Rime\" [unnumbered].\n \nAudience\n00:39:54\nApplause.\n \nEND\n00:40:06\n"],"Note":["[{\"note\":\"Year-Specific Information: \\n\\nAt the time of this reading (1970), Robert Duncan had published Tribunals Passages 31-35 (Black Sparrow Press), a broadside called Poetic Disturbances (Cody’s Books) and A Selection of 65 Drawings from the One Drawing-Book 1952-1956 (Black Sparrow Press, 1970).  He was working on Ground Work (privately printed, 1971) and Robert Duncan: An Interview by George Bowering & Robert Hogg (The Coach House Press, 1971).\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"Local Connections: \\n \\nDuncan’s first Canadian reading, in  Vancouver by invitation of Warren Tallman at University of British Columbia, occurred in 1961- to an audience of Bowering, Fred Wah and Frank Davey. These readings inspired the creation of Tish magazine[1]. Robert Duncan and George Bowering have corresponded with each other after this reading.\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"Original transcript, research, introduction and edits by Celyn Harding-Jones\\n\\nAdditional research and edits by Sarah McDonnell and Ali Barillaro\",\"type\":\"Cataloguer\"},{\"note\":\"2 reel-to-reel tapes>3 CDs>2 digital files\",\"type\":\"Preservation\"}]"],"Related_works":["[{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/robert-duncan-an-interview-april-19-1969/oclc/963367366&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Bowering, George and Robert Hogg. Robert Duncan: an interview by George Bowering &       \\tRobert Hogg. Montreal: A Beaver Kosmos Folio, 1969. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/bending-the-bow/oclc/612189355&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Duncan, Robert. Bending the Bow. New York: New Directions, 1968.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/caesars-gate-poems-1949-1950/oclc/270147363&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Duncan, Robert. Caesar’s Gate: Poems, 1949-1950. Divers Press, 1955.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/first-decade-selected-poems-1940-1950/oclc/500569831&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Duncan, Robert. First Decade: Selected Poems 1940-1950. Fulcrum, 1969.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/ground-work-before-the-war-in-the-dark/oclc/62509155&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Bertholf, Robert; Duncan, Robert; Maynard, James. Ground Work II: Before the War, In the Dark. New York: New Directions, 1985.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/heavenly-city-earthly-city/oclc/639710248&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Duncan, Robert. Heavenly and Earthly City. Berkeley: Miscellany Editions, 1949. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/opening-of-the-field/oclc/926421653&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Duncan, Robert. The Opening of the Field. Grove Press, 1960.\"},{\"url\":\"<https://www.worldcat.org/title/oxford-companion-to-american-literature/oclc/54356940&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"\\\"Duncan, Robert [Edward]\\\". The Oxford Companion to American Literature. James D. Hart (ed),        Phillip W. Leininger (rev). Oxford University Press 1995.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/roots-and-branches/oclc/926421654&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Duncan, Robert. Roots and Branches. New York: Scribners, 1964.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/new-release-from-oyez-the-years-as-catches-first-poems-1939-1946-by-robert-duncan-with-an-introduction-and-bibliography-by-the-author/oclc/62513361&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Duncan, Robert. The Years as Catches: First Poems. Berkeley: Oyez Press, 1966.\"},{\"url\":\"\",\"citation\":\"Patterson, Ian. “Duncan, Robert Edward 1919-”. Literature Online Biography. H.W. Wilson         \\tCompany, 2000. \"}]"],"_version_":1853670548887830528,"timestamp":"2026-01-07T14:59:53.477Z","digital_description":["[{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0006_11_0096-1_back.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0096-1_back.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Robert Duncan Tape Box 1 - Back\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0006_11_0096-1_front.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0096-1_front.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Robert Duncan Tape Box 1 - 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Front\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0006_11_0096-2_side.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0096-2_side.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Robert Duncan Tape Box 2 - Spine\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0006_11_0096-2_tape.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0096-2_tape.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Robert Duncan Tape Box 2 - Reel\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://files.spokenweb.ca/concordia/sgw/audio/all_mp3/robert_duncan_i006-11-096-1.mp3\",\"file_path\":\"files.spokenweb.ca>concordia>sgw>audio>all_mp3\",\"filename\":\"robert_duncan_i006-11-096-1.mp3\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"01:34:38\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"227.2 MB\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"robert_duncan_i006-11-096-1.mp3 [File 1 of 2] \\n \\nGeorge Bowering\\n00:00:00\\n...say anything about Robert Duncan's credentials, so I'll make this as brief as possible. M.L. Rosenthal [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6723336] said, a little while ago in the Reporter that Duncan [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q57421163] was the best of the poets in the experimental tradition and Warren Tolman says he's the best poet writing in the English Language, and I'd probably go further than that. And it's the reading we've been waiting for, most of us, all year, so I'd like to give him as much time as there possibly is. Robert Duncan.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:00:44\\nIn the early 50's, I belonged to a, not a group, because as a matter of fact we were scattered, some in Europe and some in America and didn't know each other, but we were all reacting to a, we all had response of a feeling of poetic responsibility and also a poetic mission, arising out of our response to the publication of Ezra Pound's [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q163366] \\\"Pisan Cantos\\\" [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q2701465] and the publication that came year after year of the parts of William Carlos Williams's [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q178106] \\\"Paterson\\\" [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q7017378] but in the same period in magazines, some of the poetry of the later William Carlos Williams was appearing. And it does interest me, although the command of the Modernists had been to write in a natural speech, that in response to features that were appearing in Williams more than Pound, because Pound's lines are all syntactic utterances, but in Williams there's a kind of enjambment and there was a juncture appearing at the end of lines. And we, we took that juncture over and imposed it upon the language, but even in imposing it, found that we had arrived at something that's quite common indeed in our English speech, the stutter is at one end of it, but it is one of the forms we have when we are emotionally excited and things are broken up into phrases and words become almost painful and impossible to say, and this encounter we explored for some time. Later, I'm going to be reading, in passages, which will bring into question radically something related to his. My poetry developed along lines that I began to see as allied to the collage, things that were appearing in American painting, that is whole elements and bits would be taken from anywhere, and very early, at the time, as a matter of fact that I was writing The Opening of the Field, I viewed myself as a kind of jackdaw of poetry and gave up entirely worrying about if I had any originality or had a voice of my own. I was much more attracted picking up things and building them into something, so I was a weaver, I felt in some ways, almost before I was a speaker, and I was a weaver of voices and did not care, or- I decided well, I happen to be the one who is doing this, so certainly that's one thing that I don't have to have an effort about. There's nothing else that's going to be moving out from here. In passages, you'll find a new feature about that collage, but it's already contained in the thing I was suggesting that we took over- the juncture, Creeley [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q918620] for instance built a whole personal style from that juncture and by making its articulation radical, and forcing it into a depth of an emotional statement, and of course of an intellectual statement, because the whole framework of thought changes. Very striking to us in the very beginning was that form was the content, not, it was very hard to determine it, you could say that it even determined content, there was no cause to effect relationship for us, between form and content. Structure determined the nature of what was to thought, like the structure of a body is to what we are, and we didn't think of them as divided, so we were incarnationists in that sense. I feel very strongly that you'll find that repeatedly a theme of my poetry the incarnation of Christ [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q302], the incarnation of spirit and the body, that spirit, that the divine world is manifest and incarnate, and that in its- led us back to the poem as the incarnation and place in which- the spirit doesn't enter poetry, incarnate, it exists. But it was also a collage and you will hear Greek and French entering this world of a collage, and it will be as reformed as the American language is when it enters my collage. And reformed to American contours, the contours of French, and the contours of Greek disappear, forced back into an American stress system, which I find analogous. The French poets were extremely disturbed when Stravinsky set them, she could not bear to hear [Persephone (?)] and because they all came out, French all came out to be Russian in its entire tonation and the French not very happy when the French language turns up in an intonation. I'm thinking of the Parisian, but no Frenchman's very happy about the French language turning up, turning out to be American or Russian. Now my poetry doesn't turn out to be exactly American either, it turns out to be strictly forced back to conform to my poetic patterns, and Greek is not intoned but is forced into a stress pattern. However, with Greek I'm in for free because there's no man who can say what you do with it anyway. In America, we have one system, in Germany, they have another system, and in England, they have, still, a third system of what to do with vowels and what to do with the whole thing. And there's a controversy about whether you do have pitch or whether you do have stress and that arises from the fact that the Hellenistic Greeks [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q428995] already couldn't figure out exactly what you did with those Greek choruses, and they had to put those marks in to instruct their readers what to do, and we don't know what those marks meant for sure [audience laughter]. But they certainly didn't know what it had been like 500 years before. They did poorer, I take it, than the poorest, and that would include me, informed of us do with Middle English [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q36395], and I guess we're nearer to it than they were. Okay, well, we'll just start out and I want to take a path, I'm going to take a path through beginning with a small group of poems from The Opening of the Field.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:07:46\\nReads \\\"The Law I Love is Major Mover” from The Opening of the Field.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:10:44\\nWhen I was about 30, a great Medieval Historian was teaching at the University of California [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q184478], where I made my living teaching, typing thesis and term papers when I was really hard out of luck and the rumour was very thick indeed that something extraordinary had happened, I think, and my impression is that Universities kill off scholars today much faster than they- they certainly don't kill off poets, they give them very handsome fees to come for a week or so, but they certainly kill off scholars, but the existence- perhaps only the World War with its refugee professors from Europe brought this kind of scholarship onto the scene at the University of California and I returned to school to take up Medieval Studies. One of the, clearly, in my work I, the one course, and I studied with that man until he left for the Princeton Institute of Advanced Learning, studied for him--with him for two and a half years, the course that most changed my poetry was a course on Medieval law, and the growth of constitutional law, because the very basis of poetry I think is a- of art, is the discovery of laws, the laws that finally we can trace through from those Medieval concepts of law and constant meditations upon law so I'm going to read a couple of more poems of our- in which this concept of law moves. This is \\\"Structure of Rime XIII\\\" and it's part of an open construct that is a construct that has nothing in its concept, does not belong to a world of cause or effect. It has a chronology, but its chronology is like our chronological time, that is seen by contemporary physics as an anomaly within a time--within a physical time that cannot possibly have the character of a chronological sequence. The best they can explain is that we must inhabit a thread that is suspended in actual time, because actual physical time cannot really be one directional, and we experience one directional time because we are really caught in some isolated thread, in the medium of time. So in \\\"Structure of Rime\\\" I conceive of myself not in a chronology, although I experience it, being human as such, but as entering such a domain in which real law exists and real time exists, and the real form to which the poem refers and from which it derives its form. The real form has no beginning or end, and is much faster, is universal, so the--in writing the poem I do not create a form, but participate in a form which is of the nature that we believe the physical world to be and I am much for a convert of Whitehead's process and reality in which we believe the spiritual world to be. And that's where \\\"The Structure of Rime\\\" takes place. When I say 'thirteen',  that's of course, in my own sequence then and I conceive of that sequence as actually existing in a part of the mosaic that does not have the character of sequence.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:14:29\\nReads \\\"Structure of Rime XIII\\\" from The Opening of the Field. \\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:16:59\\nSome time shortly after The Opening of the Field was published, I was invited up to Portland [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6106] by a lawyer and his wife to talk to a small group and I learned in correspondence that he had been attracted to my poetry because of the concepts of law as they move through poems, and so I wrote, for them, the poem called \\\"The Law\\\", a series and variation.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:17:35\\nReads \\\"The Law\\\" [from Roots and Branches].\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:23:27\\nWhen Adams [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q11806] said, “the which”, meaning, he said, \\\"Democracy, the which requires the continual exercise of virtue beyond the reach of human infirmity, even in its best estate\\\" he was writing to Jefferson and talking about something that was absolutely necessary, he did not mean that we could escape from what required what was impossible. We had to live in the impossible, which is where I found myself entirely in concord with certainly a poet understands what it is to live in the impossible. He speaks in the first place in a voice which is impossible for himself to speak in, and before which he must always be a flunk out and in some sense, a political- a poetical failure in relation to what everywhere's own poetics is to point out what is necessary. Let me in relation to the law again, read the opening of a poem that I will be later be reading entire, but I want to bring it in context with these poems and the law, and close it with a John Adams that I discovered only a passage of John Adams that I discovered for myself, only about what, it's two or three years ago, two years ago. \\\"Reading on Myth\\\", this was from a book called I think it's called 18th Century Against the Gods, or confronts--The 18th Century Confronts the Gods and the chapter on John Adams's mythology was a fascinating chapter, and this passage of the poem is built up entirely with no interpolations at all of--it's built up to the place where I cease to read it, with no interpolations at all of passages of the marginalia that John Adams writes in an Encyclopedia of Mythology.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:25:32\\nReads [\\\"John Adams’s Marginalia...\\\"].\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:26:53\\nMove back to another early poem in The Opening of the Field that was formative to, throughout my work and the last I guess it must be, each one of these is about three, this is the last ten years. The Field began in 1956, so it must be the last 14 years. And this poem is written in 1956. Take my coat off. In articulating the line, we were opening up- Pound had very early said [unintelligible] by the musical phrase and as I said, since his phrases were identical with syntactic utterances, with sentence utterances, the phrase is- the phrase is simpler than the phrases we use, where often they are enjambed, where often they disturb the meaning of the sentence and suspend elements so that they operate in various parts we did not want what was called an ambiguity by Mr. [Adams (?)], we wanted a multi-phasic area of meanings which is something very different. We wanted all parts to operate within all other parts. And I think this is a crucial difference from what let's say fascinated the metaphysicals of the post-Eliot [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q37767] period in their idea of ambiguities. We wanted one meaning operating within another meaning and they wanted one meaning secretly giving another meaning, I may have such things too, but I mean it's a very different feeling for us. Certainly they did not have to come to articulate as we did, and with these poems, when I get to, as you'll see in passages, when I get into rhythmic articulations where only my body is intelligent enough to keep them, so I have to throw them back into my hands and to my body, a dance can carry them and a dance is really in a sense, the poem in which I moved straight forward and realized how un-literary this was and not exactly song either, and that this dance centre was going to be for whole sections of poems. So, there's a key poem.\\n\\nRobert Duncan\\n00:29:27\\nReads \\\"The Dance\\\" [from The Opening of the Field].\\n\\nUnknown\\n00:31:32\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed]. \\n\\nRobert Duncan\\n00:31:33\\nResumes reading \\\"The Dance\\\" [from The Opening of the Field].\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:32:09.\\nSomeone said this evening I probably wouldn't read The Pindar poems, I will. Oh let me sing a song for you, songs, I have a couple of songs that are in books. Songs for me are not that quaint form that, a few of them are like the night nurse's songs, the song the night nurse sang. But a song of the old order and some of the other songs are actual songs, that means when I was writing them, a tune came. And they had only one voice to be in, mine, and we could even say unhappily, but there they were. And startled I was when, this is I think, one of the first songs that came that really belonged in a book of poetry. I had early had some songs in Faust Foutu in a sort of a long play that would never get performed in my mind so I was able to whatever I wanted to in it, and- which is a great kind of play to write, because you don't have to worry about anyone else solving any problems, you can name it, they can be on the moon, or whatever, have no stage dimension problems, but also of course I had no song dimension problems but when I wrote this song, \\\"Gee, I know I'm going to have to get up and sing it\\\", well of course now you'll get away with it because how rare you'd hear a poet's voice, unless a poet's already like your happy rock-n-roll singer, which I ain't as you will hear. My idea of song is exceedingly primitive indeed, my impression is very, I think you will hear it in this song, it comes from a brief period in which to much the horror of my theosophical parents, but because we were living in a small town and all your friends went to a Sunday School, I went for several years to a Methodist Sunday school and somebody along the line gave me the hint that hymns would come out much better if I just moved my mouth and didn't join in, happily, the lovely music that was going on and so of course I always wanted to write a hymn and there's something in the Methodist hymnal for sure in the song I'm going to sing. \\\"A Song of the Old Order\\\". It's not strictly Methodist in theology, but I meant that it's something of the Methodist hymn. However, I will sing also, by following another song that is certainly Calvinist [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q101849], it's a Halloween song, and like only the scotch can possibly dig out of there- the Calvinist counter hymnal.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:34:52\\nSings \\\"A Song of the Old Order\\\" [from The Opening of the Field].\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:38:05\\nThat was considerably higher than I've ever tried to do it before. [Audience laughter]. But, like a poem, when you're writing it, when you're in it, you're in for it. You can't re-model it to something you think you might get through with. So I will now do the Pindar poem. That somewhat determines what long poem we're going to do. And since this is the first time I've read here in Montreal, some other places I read, I try and give them new stuff, but I take it outside of some tapes that might be available, you haven't really heard these poems. And this will be the last one from The Opening of the Field. I'll pick up a couple from Roots and Branches and then I will be reading from the current, the Bending the Bow and then after the break I'll read some of the new poems that I've written since Bending the Bow. [Take off Biney's Law (?).] No, this is not the beginning of a Ginsberg [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6711] round [laughter.] \\\"Beginning with a Line by Pindar\\\", I am ending up with an exhibition by Ginsberg, [laughter.] We've gotten so [unintelligible] in San Francisco [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q62] since all barriers of all kinds were down you really couldn't compete with the show, so you've got, I mean what to do. Common, ordinary people are just left out, you've got to be somebody extraordinary now to [audience laughter], and poetry has to be my extraordinary thing. Believe me, the rest of me is just me. \\\"A Poem Beginning with a Line by Pindar\\\".\\n\\nRobert Duncan\\n00:40:17\\nReads \\\"A Poem Beginning with a Line by Pindar\\\" [from The Opening of the Field].\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:54:15\\nI'll read two poems from--that were requested from Roots and Branches.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:54:30\\nReads [\\\"Risk”] from Roots and Branches.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:59:22\\nThe other poem I will read from Roots and Branches is \\\"The Continent\\\". My poetic thought continuously arises from the ground of my happy and, believe me, wildly misunderstanding readings of contemporary science. And the one real poetic source I have is not a literary magazine but Scientific American [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q39379] which I avidly read. So I'm more likely to be studying language than I am to be studying poems and more likely to be studying the world, than I am to be- well, I can't say that, language and the world get even treatment. The poem \\\"The Continent\\\" came from the re-assertion that has come in recent years of evidence which has rebuilt the picture of the continental drift. And I was happy at the coordinates to find that Charles Olson [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q922978], who also ransacks the same magazine, but does not have the same misunderstandings of the magazine by any means, we have quite a, we sometimes come to [loggerheads (?) ] in our very positively taken misunderstandings of what is. He also had built sections of “Maximus [Poems]” on the continental drift. I love puns of course right away, and so does he, and if you get my drift in poetry, you will see something of what is revealed when we begin to get the drift of those continents and the fittingness of poetry is of course the logic whereby we identify that the continents originally fitted together and identified the sequence of things that happened. They do fit together, but they must have- I mean, the universe- the Neo-plateness, [unintelligible], well no, it isn't a neo-plate, well, it's a near neo-plate, and it's [unintelligible] Judas [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q81018] refers to the masterpiece which is the Universe, that's the only masterpiece and the rest of us compose masterpieces because we are children of the universe, although we may not recognize that that's what we are doing. Some of us don't have entire respect for what we belong to. \\\"The Continent\\\".\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n01:01:49\\nReads \\\"The Continent\\\" from Roots and Branches.\\n \\nUnknown\\n01:03:39\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n\\nRobert Duncan\\n01:03:40\\nResumes reading \\\"The Continent\\\" from Roots and Branches.\\n\\nRobert Duncan\\n01:06:16\\n[Unintelligible] break in tone I'll sing that song I mentioned, the second one that comes from a Calvinist anti-hymnal. It's a song from my Halloween masque. And it's “A Country Wife’s Song”, the country husband is lying in bed, snoring away and the wife rises silently, puts a stick in the bed and a stone on the pillow and sings the following song.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n01:07:50\\nPerforms “A Country Wife’s Song” [from Roots and Branches].\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n01:09:38\\nWe seem to be close to 10:30 so I'm going to just--I won't read--well, I'd like to read one passage before the intermission and I would also like to read the poem \\\"Epilogos\\\", then we'll have a break, I would suggest about 10 minutes and I will then read in the second part, I will be reading from \\\"Passages\\\", well let me add one more poem to this first part because I want to give you a sample of what I've been--so there will be one \\\"Passages\\\", so those of you with great relief run out into the world will at least have been subject to something of what \\\"Passages\\\" is like, and I will read \\\"Epilogos\\\" and then I will read one of the poems that I have written, post-Bending the Bow and then you will have a sample of everything and you won't be missing a thing if you don't stay for the second part. [Audience laughter]. Okay, well a few things, but you might be missing them anyway.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n01:10:39\\nReads \\\"Transgressing the Real, Passages 27\\\" [from Bending the Bow].\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n01:14:14\\nReads \\\"Epilogos\\\" [from Bending the Bow].\\n\\nRobert Duncan\\n01:20:57\\nNow the one poem from, poetry I've written since then, a poem called \\\"Achilles' Song\\\". One note before I read it, the island that we would ordinarily in American call ‘Leuke’ a [unintelligible], like in Leukemia--leuke. In Greek would be ‘Lay-okay’ and so I was very alarmed indeed when in this poem, as I was writing it came out ‘Loy-kay’ and it took me quite some time of sheer stage fright and horror at the mis-pronunciation recall the ‘Lauke’ in German is the [unintelligible] and so forth in German, and that I have had for years now, for some years now a tape of H.D. [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q236469] reading from her \\\"Helen in Egypt\\\", a poem which is really the mother poem of this poem, and not too much hidden in the poem, for those who know of  my closeness to H.D. who was certainly a surrogate mother for me. Thetis of the poem would certainly be the poetess H.D. and in that tape, H.D. who had lived for most of her life from the 20's on in Switzerland, uses the German pronunciation throughout, ‘Aloike’ and that's how I heard it in association with this poem. So I've finally recognized where it came from but it's an example of the fact that you cannot correct things in poems because it's sewn into a rhyme and absolutely belongs in the music here. Play it differently--I mean, it's what fits a poem not what fits some other system outside the poem that the poem must adhere to. Okay, \\\"Achilles' Song\\\".\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n01:22:44 \\nReads \\\"Achilles' Song\\\".\\n\\nUnknown\\n01:25:05\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n\\nAudience\\n01:25:06\\nApplause.\\n\\nRobert Duncan\\n01:25:16\\nSo we'll take a break of ten minutes and then I'm going to read a rather short section because we're almost at 11 and that would seem, I want to read as many, something like four passages to give you of a feeling of moving through that and that would give you something like Passages are like.\\n\\nUnknown\\n01:25:44\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n\\nRobert Duncan\\n01:25:45\\nTwo aspects of the art, seem particularly mysteries to me as I've been working at the art of poetry since I was 19 and it's now 30 years. In relation to that thing we call rhyme, meter and so forth, I have come to think more and more that it's ratios and numbers that may be the heart of the matter. And at the same time as I begin to feel that at the heart of the matter, as one begins to, as one does with mysteries, be fearful about approaching the question. Some years ago, two years ago or so, with the poet Zukofsky [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q975481], who knows much more than I do of the art, and performs really awesomely in it, I said it had begun, I said \\\"Zuk,” I said, “I had begun to feel that it isn't a question about syllables or stresses and so forth, it's a question of numbers\\\". And he said \\\"Yes, I've decided by now I ought to, certainly if I don't know syllables and stresses and so forth, by now, I mean know them only in my hand, I certainly shouldn't be thinking about them. And I am now only dealing with 8's. All of these lines are 8's, straight through. I have not yet really phased the initiations of the question of numbers but I know that this is central as one moves into the period of working in the art that I'm in.\\\" The other thing, and that is that I have indicated it earlier, is that the nature of the time of the art is increasingly mysterious, the one thing I'm sure of it cannot be, positive absolutely defined in one area, for a long time I was doing happily enough with the formula that Christians made for themselves of time and eternity and their term of eternity which is the very present moment of any work of art and is also of course somehow containing the ensemble of all of the things created must also be like that time that physics talks about. That makes them puzzle why in the world our own time goes from a thing we call the past to the future. Whitehead [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q183372] solves it in Process and Reality by suggesting that we create, in every moment that we live a past and a future, and we live in a history consequently because that's what we create what we are, is pastness and future, and sum it up in a material, that is still persuasive. But a mystery is when none of the answers are answers and as long as they're not answers the artist has them as really, forces that move as art. Now I make this remark because, well I said something about chronologies I, in the past I have not read these two poems as they appear in the book, in readings, but I want to read them today and I'm going to just underline the transition I want you to see and share with me at this point. I arranged, for all that what I've said about chronologies, I arranged the poems in my volumes chronologically and largely because it seems to me a mystery as they go and the rhymes appear from one to the other, and one poem will be an announcement of a succeeding poem or themes will flow out of it. The one I'm going to read first is not a “Passages\\\" it's called \\\"Reflections\\\" and at the close, and as a theme of it, you will find the old man, who is as a matter of fact, I structure rhyme preceding it had a fire master appearing, who seems very close indeed to the master of fire, and the poem that came next, it may have been in a couple of weeks of so, this was a very productive period, concludes with a figure of an old man tuning a drum between a bowl of fire and a bowl of water, and it was followed by a \\\"Passages\\\" which is called \\\"The Fire\\\", and from it we can learn that the fire that you see in \\\"Passages\\\" which is catastrophic, and is held in a polarity with an ideogram with the natural world, that that which may have indeed be--is indeed a bowl of water, as you will see, I mean it's a stream of water that the fire is composed between a world of water and its own world of fire, but that fire that looks like a catastrophe you will find is the creative fire--if you go under \\\"Reflections\\\" and let the reflections that came first reflect into the poem following. Now these are things that you realize afterwards, in your own chronology. I am one of those poets who has the characteristic I find in my study of Whitman [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q81438] in the last three years that Whitman certainly was another poet who studied himself all the time. We have a great prohibition in our contemporary world against studying yourself, but I am not short on the world of ego, so I'm not really very disturbed about the fact that I study myself in the poetry. But the one thing I search to find is not something we would ordinarily call ourselves, I study the poet, the thing that the poems are creating in order for them to come into being. That I can sharply distinguish from myself. As sharply as you can do it, it takes office, the idea of office, and this again I got from my Medieval Studies. Okay, I'm going to read \\\"Reflections\\\" and then I'm going to read \\\"The Fire\\\" and then I will, the poems I will be reading from then on will be \\\"Passages\\\", \\\"Fire\\\" is one of \\\"Passages\\\". And \\\"Passages\\\" is as I explained, an open form that exists in these other universe of time, of something, like, you call eternity.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n01:32:07\\nReads \\\"Reflections\\\" [from Bending the Bow].\\n \\nEND\\n01:34:38\\n\",\"notes\":\"Robert Duncan reads from The Opening of the Field (Grove Press, 1960), Roots and Branches (New Directions, 1964), and Bending the Bow (New Directions, 1968).\\n\\nI006-11-096.1=AC.1\\n\\n00:00- George Bowering introduces Robert Duncan [INDEX: M.L. Rosenthall, Warren Tallman [sp?], The Reporter, experimental poetry]\\n00:44- Robert Duncan speaks about his poetry, introduces reading. [INDEX: Ezra Pound’s       \\t“Pisan Cantos”, William Carlos William’s “Paterson” and other poetry, impact of the   \\tmodernist tradition, natural speech, syntactic utterances, enjambment in the line, collage,      \\tAmerican Painting, The Opening of the Field, voice, Robert Creeley, form of content,      \\tincarnation of Christ,  Greek and French languages, Igor Stravinsky, Middle English]\\n07:46- Reads “The Law I Love is Major Mover” from The Opening of the Field [all poems to   follow are from this book]\\n10:44- Introduces “The Structure of Rime XIII”. [INDEX: Medieval Historian teaching at         \\tUniversity of California, World War refugee Professors migrating from Europe, Princeton         \\tInstitute for Advanced Learning, Medieval Law, discovery of laws, open construct poem,         \\tchronological time]\\n14:29- Reads “The Structure of Rime XIII”\\n16:59- Introduces “The Law”\\n17:35- Reads “The Law”\\n23:27- Introduces first line “John Adams Marginalia...” [INDEX: John Adams, Democracy, \\tThomas Jefferson, The 18th Century Confronts the Gods by Frank E. Manuel, Encyclopedia of Mythology]\\n25:32- Reads first line “John Adams Marginalia...”\\n25:53- Introduces “The Dance” and discusses his poetry [INDEX: The Opening of the Field,   \\tEzra Pound, phrases and lines, enjambments, disturb meaning of sentences, multi-phasic      \\tarea of meanings, Mr. Adamson [?], metaphysics of the post-Eliot period, rhythmic      \\tarticulations, dance]\\n29:27- Reads “The Dance” [recording is cut and then resumes at 31:33.90]\\n32:09- Introduces “A Song of the Old Order” [INDEX: Songs, process of writing songs, Faust Foutu An Entertainment in Four parts (play), Methodist Sunday School, Methodist   hymnal, Calvinist counter hymnal]\\n34:52- Sings “A Song of the Old Order”\\n38:05- Introduces “A Poem Beginning with the Line by Pindar”, outlines the rest of the       \\treading. [INDEX: Roots and Branches, Bending the Bow, new poems, Allen Ginsberg    \\t‘show’, San Francisco]\\n40:17- Reads “A Poem Beginning with the Line by Pindar”\\n54:15.78- END OF RECORDING\\n \\nI006-11-096.1=AC.2\\n \\n00:00- Robert Duncan introduces “Risk” [INDEX:Roots and Branches]\\n00:14- Reads first line “Risk”\\n05:06- Introduces “The Continent” [INDEX: poetry from contemporary science, Scientific     \\tAmerican magazine, continental drift, Charles Olson, The Maximus Poems, neo-plates]\\n07:33- Reads “The Continent”\\n12:00- Introduces “Song”\\n12:49- Sings “Song”\\n15:22- Introduces series of poems [INDEX: “Epilogos”, Of the War: Passages 22-27,   \\tBending the Bow]\\n16:23- Reads “Transgressing the Real”\\n19:58- Reads “Epilogos”\\n26:41- Introduces “Achilles' Song” [INDEX: mispronunciation of Greek Island Leuke, H.D.   \\treading “Helen in Egypt”, Switzerland, German]\\n28:28- Reads “Achilles' Song”\\n31:00- Introduces poems read after the break\\n31:29- Introduces “Reflections” and talks about his poetry [INDEX: Rhyme, meter, ratios and    numbers, Louis Zukofsky, time and eternity, Alfred North Whitehead’s Process and Reality, chronology, Of the War: Passages 22-27, “The Fire”, “Reflections”]\\n37:51- Reads “Reflections”\\n40:23.12- END OF RECORDING\\n\",\"title\":\"\",\"credit\":\"\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Sound Recording\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/sgw-poetry-readings/robert-duncan-at-sgwu-1970/#1\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://files.spokenweb.ca/concordia/sgw/audio/all_mp3/robert_duncan_i006-11-096-2.mp3\",\"file_path\":\"files.spokenweb.ca>concordia>sgw>audio>all_mp3\",\"filename\":\"robert_duncan_i006-11-096-2.mp3\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"00:40:06\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"96.3 MB\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"robert_duncan_i006-11-096-2.mp3 [File 2 of 2] \\n\\nRobert Duncan\\n00:00:00\\nReads [“The Fire, Passages 13 from Bending the Bow; recording begins abruptly].\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:13:11\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed]. \\n\\nRobert Duncan\\n00:13:12\\n...beginning with a poem called \\\"Soldiers\\\", a poem in which, um, let's see, right, some lines of Victor Hugo [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q535] enter, I decided I should, well, I guess, lets see, no I don't want to read too late, and soldiers is rather long again, so I want- certain themes that are moving in \\\"Soldiers\\\" will reappear. In \\\"Soldiers\\\", a recurring line was one from a poem of Victor Hugo's, \\\"Dieu dans [unintelligible] reve\\\", which is a line really quite in tune with my own poetics, \\\"God, oh creator the- or the creator for us too in oneself whose dream, whose work goes much further than our dreams\\\" and so it's combined with a scene that's Vietnam and it's combined in the Soldiers with the theme of the recognition that in some mystery of that work that goes further than our dreams the soldiers in Vietnam most of them, have just there, and they're 19 or 18 and so forth, they have only there in which to make their lives. And they have only there in which to, to take their souls in the war, as the followers of Orpheus take soul in the poem. The wood to take fire from that dirty flame. A recognition that that is their field in which they must reach life's epiphany and its thing. And the line of Victor Hugo carried me forward to and returned me to grand themes of Victor Hugo's but it also took me back to Vietnam [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q881] and I wanted to give, before I read \\\"The Kao Dai\\\" a little sketch of that. There's a theme of Victor Hugo, by the way, of the fall of Lucifer [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q185498] in which, Lucifer's falling into his own denial of God and in falling he opens the univ- creation, and but in his falling a feather breaks loose from his wings and is floating mid-air, and the sight of God descending falls upon the feather and it becomes light and it turns into an angel and that angel is Liberty and that angel's entire message is to transform the rage and wrathful light that had fallen upon it into the reunion and resurrection of Satan, but of course both Satan and God must be called from their wrath, to reconciliation, so this angel, Liberty and Freedom is also the angel of reconciliation and Victor Hugo knew that also there must be some explanation for the fact that the desire and yearning for freedom and liberty has always been wrathful. Blake [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q41513] is puzzled by the same thing and I think that today, when all over the world, not only in Canada [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q16], but in the United States [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q30], and in China [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q29520], and Yugoslavia [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q36704] and Russia [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q159] the wrath of Liberty is rising and it is the wrath of God against the civilization to its very roots which we know in our hearts are Godless. But that wrath must be reconciled, because it is itself that it's rising against and there's some mystery in this, so my poetry has begun to take up the figure of that angel and the angel comes into it. Now, in Vietnam, one of the strongest forces in the Viet Cong, not a communist group but a religious group, the Cao Dai [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q470364] and in order to read more in deeper into the Cao Dai, I wisely, I think, went back to sources to the early thirties before Vietnam was quite the cause it is today, and found this story and it came quite in line with my kooky family and my own poetry because it was at a medium's table in 1925 on Christmas Eve, when Christ descended and speaking in French, as I usually put it when I read my, something worse than American French, a French man would feel that that was blasphemy, but I'm after all repeating Christ's words in his own voice so that might be more serious yet that that voice was being attempted. Christ came into the medium and renounced in my birth day for the spirit is descending upon Vietnam and when we remember what happened to the very first generation of Christians who were burned in rows as torches, what the promise of Christ meant to his immediate blessing, the powers of martyrdom. The promise of Christ in 1925 was amply fulfilled to his new disciples. So amply, as a matter of fact, the Cao Dai had more than come to my mind, because the cathedral town of Cao Dai, which is [unintelligible] indeed exactly like a Catholic nunnery or convent, or a Buddhist nunnery or convent is Communist, is the province of Tay Ninh [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q36608], and the Cathedral city of Tay Ninh, now it is been repeated over and over in American papers that when those planes were returning for missions in North Vietnam and hadn't dumped their missions, you're not supposed to return any bombs, you gotta dump them somewhere, so they'd dump them on Tay Ninh, you'd just go over the side and dump them on Tay Ninh, because this particular religious group was stubborn indeed in its inherences. Now, also interesting to me was this particular religious group had as its patron Saint Victor Hugo, and the first place that the French are, that the Vietnamese have French as their deepest religious and literary language and so Christ talked in French so Victor Hugo gave the whole line, it's Victor Hugo's Christ who talked to them at the medium tables in French, and they of course had their medium tables in the line of the tradition of Victor Hugo's own medium tables in the Isle of Jersey. So Victor Hugo becomes patron saint for these passages. In the passage, by the way, a passage called \\\"Orders\\\" and I will read a passage from it in which I am actually translating from Victor Hugo quite directly but it's a very long poem and keeping in tune with that master of the sublime is very difficult for us in the modern period. Here we are, the passage, wait a minute, it isn't in that poem, I always think it's in \\\"Orders\\\", but it's actually in place of a passage 22, that has the passage with Victor Hugo. I have been working on it for years, and it's mainly trying to keep in tune, I go over and over and over it again and then I find it very difficult to deal with 19th century poetry. But this is a passage straight translation, as literal as I could from Victor Hugo, but really, massive poem.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:21:11\\nReads \\\"The Soldiers\\\" [from Bending the Bow].\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:22:14\\nCharming little poem called the \\\"Twentieth Century\\\", in case you want to know where we are.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:22:22\\nReads \\\"Twentieth Century\\\" [published as “The Light, Passages 28” in Bending the Bow].\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:30:27\\nI'll close with \\\"Stage Directions\\\".\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:30:32\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n\\nRobert Duncan\\n00:30:33\\nReads [“Stage Directions, Passages 30” from Bending the Bow; begins mid-poem].\\n \\nAudience\\n00:37:53\\nApplause.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:38:12\\nI'll add one more poem which has not been read aloud except at home today, this is one--I hope I've got the right note--this is a \\\"Structure of Rime\\\" that was composed on April Fool's day but it doesn't mean it isn't serious, I mean April 1st.\\n \\nRobert Duncan\\n00:38:32\\nReads \\\"Structure of Rime\\\" [unnumbered].\\n \\nAudience\\n00:39:54\\nApplause.\\n \\nEND\\n00:40:06\\n\",\"notes\":\"Robert Duncan reads from The Opening of the Field (Grove Press, 1960), Roots and Branches (New Directions, 1964), and Bending the Bow (New Directions, 1968).\\n\\n00:00- Recording starts mid-sentence, reading “The Fire”\\n13:12- Introduces “Soldiers” [INDEX: lines by Victor Hugo, Vietnam, Orpheus, “The Kao Dai”,        Lucifer, Satan and God, Liberty and Freedom, William Blake, Canada, U.S., China,     Yugoslavia, Russia, Viet Cong, Province of Tay Ninh, U.S. dumping bombs, Isle of Jersey, passage “Orders”]\\n21:11- Reads “Soldiers”\\n22:14- Introduces “Twentieth Century”\\n22:22- Reads “Twentieth Century”\\n30:27- Reads “Stage Directions”\\n38:12- Introduces “Structure of Rime”, first line “Away from the green fist of the sleeping     \\tchild”\\n38:32- Reads “Structure of Rime”, first line “Away from the green fist of the sleeping child”\\n40:06.70- END OF TRANSCRIPT\\n \\n1.  “The Law I Love” from the “Opening of the Seal”\\nPlease note that the Howard Fink list states the reading took place in “Spring 1970”, while the interview states another (perhaps separate) reading took place on April 19, 1969.\\n\\n2 reels: 30 min 3 3/4ips, 1/4” 5” reel\\n60 min 3 3/4 ips, 1/4” 7”reel\\nPopped strands in tape 1\\n\",\"title\":\"\",\"credit\":\"\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Sound Recording\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/sgw-poetry-readings/robert-duncan-at-sgwu-1970/#2\"}]"],"score":2.9979138},{"id":"1279","cataloger_name":["Masoumeh,Zaare"],"partnerInstitution":["Concordia University"],"collection_source_collection":["SGWU Reading Series-Concordia University Department of English fonds"],"source_collection_label":["SGWU Reading Series-Concordia University Department of English fonds"],"collection_contributing_unit":["Records Management and Archives"],"source_collection_uri":[""],"collection_image_url":[""],"collection_source_collection_description":["The fonds consists of some administrative records of the SGWU Department of English and the Concordia Department of English between 1971 and 2000. It also consists of some SGWU Department of English records related to student academic activities in the 1940s and to public readings and lectures, and a few interviews, produced between 1966 and 1972. The fonds mainly includes minutes of departmental meetings and some course timetables. It also includes some student papers in bound volumes and 63 sound recordings (80 audio reels) mainly composed of poetry readings (see the Concordia SpokenWeb project which uses this material) but also a few lectures given at SGWU. There are also loose typed sheets describing some of the SGWU poetry readings."],"collection_source_collection_id":["I086"],"persistent_url":["http://archives.concordia.ca/I086"],"item_title":["Jerome Rothenberg at Sir George Williams University, The Poetry Series, 17 October 1969"],"item_title_source":["Cataloguer"],"item_title_note":["\"JEROME ROTHENBERG Recorded October 16, 1969 3.75 ips, 1/2 track on 1 mil. tape 43 minutes\" written on sticker on the back of the tape's box. \"JEROME ROTHENBERG I006/SR95\" written on sticker on the spine of the tape's box. \"I006-11-095\" written on sticker on the reel"],"item_language":["English"],"item_production_context":["Documentary recording"],"item_series_title":["The Poetry Series"],"item_subseries_title":["Poetry 4"],"item_identifiers":["[]"],"creator_names":["Rothenberg, Jerome"],"creator_names_search":["Rothenberg, Jerome"],"creators":["[{\"url\":\"http://viaf.org/viaf/109302361\",\"name\":\"Rothenberg, Jerome\",\"dates\":\"1931-\",\"notes\":\"American poet, teacher, translator, performance artist and editor Jerome Rothenberg was born in New York City in 1931. He received his B.A. in 1952 from the City College of New York and his M.A. in 1953 from the University of Michigan. Directly after graduation, Rothenberg enrolled in the military and served until 1955. He then worked on additional graduate work at Columbia University from 1956-1959. Rothenberg’s first collection of poetry, White Sun Black Sun (1960) was published through the small press Hawk’s Well Press, which he founded in 1958 to promote the works of young poets. He also edited the magazine Poems from a Floating World which ran from 1959-1964. At that time, Rothenberg began a long and influential career as a teacher of both Literature and Visual Arts; he worked at the City College of New York (1960-61), the Mannes College of Music (1961-1970), the University of California, San Diego (1971), and at the New School for Social Research (1971-72). Along with his poetry, Rothenberg translated the works of German postwar poets Paul Celan, Gunter Grass and Ingeborg Bachman; the translations influenced many of the poets of the Beat movement. Rothenberg then published his own poetry in The Seven Hells of the Jigoku Zoshi (Trobar, 1962), Sightings (Hawk’s Well, 1964), The Gorky Poems (El Corno Emplumado, 1966), Between: 1960-1963 (Fulcrum, 1967), Poland/1931, Part I (Unicorn Press, 1969), Poems for the Game of Silence (Dial, 1970), Seneca Journal, Midwinter (Singing Bone, 1975) and his popular anthology Shaking the Pumpkin: Traditional Poetry of the Indian North Americas (Doubleday, 1972). Rothenberg then taught at the University of Wisconsin (1974-77), the University of California, San Diego (1977-85), the State University of New York (SUNY) at Albany in 1986 and at Binghamton from 1986-1988, and finally at the University of California, San Diego. More of his poetry collections include Narratives and Realtheater Pieces (Braad, 1978), Poems for the Society of the Mystic Animals (Tetrad, 1979), Abulafia’s Circles (Membrane, 1979), Vienna Blood (New Directions, 1983), Altar Piece (Station Hill, 1982), That Dada Strain (New Directions, 1983), Khurbn & Other Poems (New Directions, 1989), Lorca Variations (New Directions, 1993) which won the PEN Oakland Josephine Miles Literary Award in 1994, Seedings (New Directions, 1996) and A Paradise of Poets (New Directions, 1999). Rothenberg has won, among many other honors, the Wenner-Gren Foundation for Anthropological Research grant in 1968, fellowships fro the Guggenheim Foundation in 1974 and the National Endowment for the Arts in 1976. His first collection of essays on poetics, Pre-Faces (New Directions, 1982) won the American Book Award that same year. Rothenberg continues to teach in the Visual Arts and Literature Departments, as a Professor Emeritus at the University of California at San Diego.\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Author\",\"Performer\"]}]"],"contributors_names":["Bowering, George"],"contributors_names_search":["Bowering, George"],"contributors":["[{\"url\":\"http://viaf.org/viaf/34469976\",\"name\":\"Bowering, George\",\"dates\":\"1935-\",\"notes\":\"\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Series organizer\",\"Performer\"]}]"],"performer_name":["Bowering, George"],"Series_organizer_name":["Bowering, George"],"Performance_Date":[1969],"material_description":["[{\"side\":\"\",\"image\":\"\",\"other\":\"\",\"extent\":\"1/4 inch\",\"AV_types\":\"Audio\",\"tape_brand\":\"Scotch\",\"generations\":\"\",\"Conservation\":\"\",\"equalization\":\"\",\"playback_mode\":\"Mono\",\"playing_speed\":\"3 3/4 ips\",\"sound_quality\":\"Good\",\"recording_type\":\"Analogue\",\"storage_capacity\":\"\",\"physical_condition\":\"\",\"track_configuration\":\"Half-track\",\"material_designation\":\"Reel to Reel\",\"physical_composition\":\"Magnetic Tape\",\"accompanying_material\":\"\",\"other_physical_description\":\"\"}]"],"material_designations":["Reel to Reel"],"physical_compositions":["Magnetic Tape"],"recording_type":["Analogue"],"AV_type":["Audio"],"playback_mode":["Mono"],"Dates":["[{\"date\":\"1969 10 17\",\"type\":\"Performance Date\",\"notes\":\"Date written on sticker on the back of the tape's box.\",\"source\":\"Accompanying Material\"}]"],"Location":["[{\"url\":\"https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/22080570\",\"venue\":\"Hall Building Room H-651\",\"notes\":\"Location specified in written announcement \\\"Poetry Four: Sir George Williams Poetry Series\\\"\",\"address\":\"1455, Boul de Maisonneuve Ouest, Montreal, Quebec, Canada\",\"latitude\":\"45.4972758\",\"longitude\":\"-73.57893043\"}]"],"Address":["1455, Boul de Maisonneuve Ouest, Montreal, Quebec, Canada"],"Venue":["Hall Building Room H-651"],"City":["Montreal, Quebec"],"content_notes":["Jerome Rothenberg reads poems published later in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972) and from Poland/1931 (Unicorn Press, 1969)."],"contents":["jerome_rothenberg_i006-11-095.mp3\n\nGeorge Bowering\n00:00:00\nI'm glad we got this room. Welcome back to the first night of the fourth year of our series. And for those of you who are here for the first time, welcome you too. I'm really glad that we could start off with Jerome Rothenberg [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1775056], especially from my own personal viewpoint, because while Jerome Rothenberg is one of the names that I've paid a lot of attention to, and one of the names that poets have paid attention to over the last decade, this'll be the first time that I've been able to hear him read, too. Usually when, often when us people from the West think about the new American poetry, we tend to think of it in terms of people from outposts such as New Mexico [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1522], and Utah, [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q829] and San Francisco [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q62], and so on. And we forget that New York City [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q60] is one of the centre-place, central-places, so that it can produce poets such as Joel Oppenheimer [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6213806] who will be here in the following spring, and Paul Blackburn [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q7149388], who was here a couple of years ago. Jerome Rothenberg has always been the centre, in the centre of that scene, and not only as one of the principal poets, but as editor, and publisher, and so on and so forth, especially with a very important magazine of the 1960's called some--oblique thing [some/thing]. And he's especially interesting to me too because of the kind of work that produced a book such as Technicians of the Sacred, a compilation of the poetries from various oral traditions around the world, and a similar sort of impulse has always been at the centre of his work too. I'd also like to correct a mistake on the little printed page that wasn't really mine, that I picked up from somewhere else and couldn't quite believe myself, that said that Jerome Rothenberg was born in 1921. All I can say is that he was born sometime between the death of Lord Byron [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q5679] and now. [Laughter]. But I'm pretty certain that he wasn't around in 1921. So I'd like you to give a welcome to Jerome Rothenberg.\n \nAudience\n00:02:53\nApplause.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:02:58\nThe birthdate'll come clearer in the second part of the reading. I'll read in two parts. And in the first set, what I'll be reading are translations and re-workings of American Indian poetry, which have been important to me over the last five or six years. And I'll start with some which are based on earlier translations, re-workings of material previously translated, and then as I get into it, some translations that result from direct contact and direct experience of American Indian poetry. This is an Aztec poem. The first four or five, six poems will be Aztec or Mexican in origin, and the theme will be flowers.  \"Offering Flowers\".\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:04:24\nReads \"Offering Flowers\" [from Technicians of the Sacred].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:07:37\nThis is Aztec, too, in origin, translated through the Spanish.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:07:52\nReads “A Song of Chalco” [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:09:53\nAnd it doesn't die out, even with the destruction that follows, and flowers are picked up again, this in a series of translations, again through the Spanish, of a series of Peyote songs, from the Huichol Indians of central Mexico [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q96]. The name Wirikuta [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q8026952] is the name given to the place of the gods, and the spiritual place of the Peyote. The Peyote is described as the rose, it's described as the corn, the maize, it's described under a number of images, and through the figure, the mythological figure of one called the Blue Stag. This is the first Huichol, Peyote song.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:10:46\nReads “First Peyote Song” [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:11:46.19\n\"Song of an Initiate\".\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:11:51\nReads \"Song of an Initiate\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:12:25\nAnd this is a poem called \"How the Violin Was Born: A Peyote Account”.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:12:35\nReads \"How the Violin was Born: A Peyote Account” [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:13:24\nThese are a few short Indian pieces. Not poems but part of what's connected with the whole activity of poetry, among the tribal peoples. Which is more than an activity of words; which goes beyond language. And these are the events that accompany the words. And the first is an Iroquois dream event. \n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:13:58\nReads [\"Dream Event 1\", published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:14:08\nThese are a series of vision events. The first two are Eskimo.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:14:14\nReads \"Vision Event I\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n\nJerome Rothenberg\n00:14:25\nReads \"Vision Event 2\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:14:39\nAnd this is a Sioux Indian vision event.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:14:43\nReads \"Vision Event 3\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:15:01\nThis is a Kwakiutl Indian gift event. All the words are from Kwakiut'l Indians. It's either spoken in English or translated into English. The Kwakiut'l, like other Northwest Coast people, celebrate the potlatch, you know, which is not always terrible or distasteful in its consequences. This is benevolent gift-giving. \n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:15:26\nReads \"Gift Event [2]\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:16:32\nThese are a series of seven Navajo animal songs. \n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:16:42\nReads \"Navajo Animal Songs\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:17:49\nThe next few are from a series of translations I've been doing, are called, well, it's the Seneca Indian word for one of their major curing ceremonies, a term for a major curing ceremony, \"Shaking the Pumpkin\", because the pumpkin rattle, the big pumpkin rattle is the major instrument used in this. Or it's got a more ornate name, it's called \"The Society of the Mystic Animals\". The man, Richard Johnny John, Indian, who is working with me on this, explained it's a serious ceremony, he said, but if everything's alright, the one who says the prayer tells them, I leave it up to you, folks, and if you want to have a good time, have a good time. Well everything's alright in the translations, you know, so one eases up there. The translations are done trying to follow everything in the Seneca, including the meaning of the sounds, the hey-ya and the way-oh-hey, that are very common in Indian poetry. Basically the way I do it is to present them visually on the page, and I can't do this in reading them, so I'm just going to select out of these poems that read easily. The purpose is curing, and well-being. \n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:19:34\nReads [\"Caw Caw the Crows Caw Caw\" published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:19:49\nReads \"Two more about a crow, in the manner of Zukofsky\" [later published in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:20:05\nThree poems about the owl, on the page, the vocables, the sounds, make the figure of an owl, even as in the singing of the song, the sound of the owl comes through. But here are just the words.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:20:19\nReads \"The Owl: One\".\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:20:25\nReads \"The Owl: Two\".\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:20:32\nReads \"The Owl: Three\".\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:20:40\n\"A Song of My Song, In Three Parts”.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:20:45\nReads \"A Song of My Song, In Three Parts\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:20:59\nReads “Three Ways to Screw Up on Your Way to the Doings” [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:21:16\nBuckets are important, to bring back soup and...The last one from this series.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:21:31\nReads “Where the Song Went Where She Went & What Happened When they Met” [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:22:15\nThe next are a little harder to do, but I hope I make it. The Senecas don't use many words. It's a kind of minimal poetry and the power is in the compression. The Navajos use more words, the poetry gets dense, and in addition they use many many non-verbal sounds. And in addition, they distort many of the words in the singing. So that if you translate just for the meaning, you're only getting a small part of what the Navajo is doing. And then in addition, everything is sung in the Navajo. So I began to translate a series called, because that's what they are, \"The Seventeen Horse Songs of Frank Mitchell\". Seventeen horse-blessing, horse-curing songs that were the property of a Navajo medicine man named Frank Mitchell. And the problem that came up for me, I couldn't translate just for meaning, I wanted to, you know, consider all of the factors that went into the poem. So I began to insert sounds corresponding to the sound of the English words as the Navajo had the meaning of the sounds, and to distort the words. And then it seemed to me that it was necessary to carry this further, to begin to sing the songs as well. Which came to me with great difficulty. But I've gotten through a number of them now, and what I'll do is sing one, the \"Tenth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell,\" and then do a tape for three voices of another one of the horse songs. You'll notice the words are rather similar from one to another, the melody changes. In this, and the Navajos of course would know this, the hero, Enemy-Slayer, has gone to the house of his father, the sun up there, to bring back horses for the people. And in this Tenth Horse Song, it's mostly the father, the sun, speaking, telling him to bring the horses back to the house of his mother, you know, who everybody understands to be Changing Woman. Bring it back to the earth. And sometimes the voice of Enemy-Slayer comes into it.  But the basic refrain is to \"go to the woman, go to her.\" \n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:25:24\nPerforms \"Tenth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell\" [from The 17 Horse-Songs of Frank Mitchell]. \n \nAudience\n00:31:25\nApplause.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:31:38\nThe next one, and I guess the last piece in the first set, is the \"Twelfth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell\". The melody changes. Some of the distortions change. The burden changes, and now Enemy-Slayer contemplates the horses coming back to earth with him, in the same sequence. This is done on tape, with three voices. I think that's about all there is to say about it. Three voices.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:32:23\nPlays recording of \"Twelfth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell\", sung by three voices [from The 17 Horse-Songs of Frank Mitchell and published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nAudience\n00:39:42\nApplause.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:39:48\nIn fact, let me end this set with a live poem, I don't want to end with a machine. This is another Aztec poem called \"The Flight of Quetzalcoatl\". The plumed serpent, bird-snake man. In which he discovers that he's become old, and leaves and goes on a long journey, and is reborn as the morning star.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:40:39\nReads \"The Flight of Quetzalcoatl\" [later published in Shaking the Pumpkin].\n \nAudience\n00:47:17\nApplause. \n \nUnknown\n00:47:20\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n \nGeorge Bowering\n00:47:20\nOkay, we'll hold for about ten minutes, and open the doors and get cool, and then come back. \n \nUnknown\n00:47:27\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:47:28\nThe second set will be a straight reading, whatever that means, from a long series of poems called \"Poland/1931\". A series of ancestral poems. So Poland [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q36] is where the ancestors come from, for some number, hundreds of years. And that is Jewish Poland. And 1931, rather than 1921, is the year of my birth. And it's in a sense, though I don't keep to it too strictly, everything before that. To try to build up a world that I really don't know.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:48:29\nReads \"Poland/1931: The Wedding\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:50:46\nReads \"The King of the Jews\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:51:52\nThe next one's called \"The Key of Solomon\". It's the name of a medieval, a series of medieval magical books that were supposed to go back to the times of Solomon [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q37085]. \n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:57:07\nReads \"The Key of Solomon\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:53:42\n\"The Beadle's Testimony.\" Because beadles were a demon.\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:53:47\nReads \"The Beadle's Testimony\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:54:53\nTwo poems called \"Soap\".\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:54:57\nReads \"Soap \" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:55:56\nReads \"Soap II” [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:57:37\nReads \"The Rabbi's Testimony\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n00:59:08\nReads \"The Connoisseur of Jews\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:00:38\nReads \"The Beards\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:03:32\nReads \"The Mothers I\" [from Poland/1931]. \n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:04:08\nReads \"The Mothers II\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:04:43\nReads \"The Mothers III\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:05:19\nReads \"Milk & Honey I\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:06:00\nReads \"Milk & Honey II\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:06:31\nReads \"Ancestral Scenes\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:07:09\nReads \"The Fathers\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:09:10\nThis one is called \"Portrait of the Jew, Old Country Style\".\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:09:16\nReads \"Poland, 1931: Portrait of the Jew, Old Country Style\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:11:51\nThis is a longer one, called \"The Student's Testimony\"\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:12:04\nReads \"The Student's Testimony\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:17:49\nA somewhat shorter one, and then another long one, and then a quite short one and that's...that's it. \n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:17:58\nReads \"The Brothers\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:20:10\nReads \"The Steward's Testimony\" [from Poland/1931].\n\nAudience\n01:25:15\nLaughter and applause [faint].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:25:20\nNow, I'll end it with, I'll end it with two poems. \"A Poem for the Christians\". It's partly to...[Audience laughter]...it's a found poem from the prayer book. But you can see where there are changes, you know. [Audience laughter].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:25:42\nReads \"A Poem for the Christians\" [from Poland/1931].\n \nJerome Rothenberg\n01:26:45\nReads \"Fish and Paradise\".\n \nEND\n01:27:32\n[Cut off abruptly]."],"Note":["[{\"note\":\"Year-Specific Information:\\n\\nJerome Rothenberg published Poland/1931 (Unicorn Press, 1969) and The Directions (Tetrad Press, 1969) with Tom Phillips and was teaching at the Mannes College for Music.\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"Local Connections:\\n\\nDirect connection to Sir George Williams University is unknown. Jerome Rothenberg was an influential member of contemporary American poetry, and had correspondences with other members of the poetry reading series, such as Robert Creeley, Paul Blackburn, Allen Ginsberg, Robert Kelly, Jackson Mac Low, bp Nichol, Gary Snyder and Diane Wakoski (please see Rothenberg’s papers for correspondences).\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"Original transcript and print catalogue by Rachel Kyne\\n\\nOriginal print catalogue, research, introduction and edits by Celyn Harding-Jones\\n\\nAdditional research and edits by Ali Barillaro\\n\",\"type\":\"Cataloguer\"},{\"note\":\"Reel-to-reel tape>2 CDs>digital file\",\"type\":\"Preservation\"}]"],"Related_works":["[{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/oxford-companion-to-twentieth-century-poetry-in-english/oclc/954547274&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Gilbert, Roger. \\\"Rothenberg, Jerome\\\". The Oxford Companion to Twentieth-Century Poetry in English. Ian Hamilton. Oxford University Press, 1996.\"},{\"url\":\"https://visarts.ucsd.edu/people/emeriti-faculty/jerome-rothenberg.html?_ga=2.257346699.1600795371.1609275761-1945262426.1609275761\",\"citation\":\"“Jerome Rothenberg”. Faculty Description. University of California at San Diego. \"},{\"url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/sgw-poetry-readings/jerome-rothenberg-at-sgwu-1969/\",\"citation\":\"“Poetry Four: Sir George Williams Poetry Series, First Reading”. Montreal: Sir George Williams University, 1969. \"},{\"url\":\"http://www.oac.cdlib.org/data/13030/gk/tf0n39n7gk/files/tf0n39n7gk.pdf\",\"citation\":\"“Register of the Jerome Rothenberg Papers, 1944-1985”. Online Archives of California.   University of California, San Diego.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/17-horse-songs-of-frank-mitchell-nos-x-xiii-total-translations-from-the-navaho-indian/oclc/976986882&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Rothenberg, Jerome. The 17 Horse-Songs of Frank Mitchell. London: Tetrad Press, 1969.\"},{\"url\":\"http://d7.drunkenboat.com/db3/rothenberg/rothenberg.html\",\"citation\":\"Rothenberg, Jerome. “Pre-Face to a Symposium on Ethnopoetics (1975)”. Drunken Boat Online Journal of the Arts, Issue 3: Fall/Winter 2001-2002.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/shaking-the-pumpkin-traditional-poetry-of-the-indian-north-americas/oclc/1131195375&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Rothenberg, Jerome. Shaking the Pumpkin. New York: Doubleday, 1972. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/seneca-journal/oclc/898040552&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Rothenberg, Jerome. A Seneca Journal. New York: New Directions, 1971.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/technicians-of-the-sacred-a-range-of-poetries-from-africa-america-asia-europe-and-oceania/oclc/1005090292&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Rothenberg, Jerome. Technicians of the Sacred. New York: Doubleday/Anchor Books, 1969.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/poems-1964-1967/oclc/869018006&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Rothenberg, Jerome. Poems 1964-1967. Los Angeles: Black Sparrow Press, 1968. \"},{\"url\":\"\",\"citation\":\"“Rothenberg, Jerome, 1931-”. Literature Online Biography. Cambridge: Chadwyck-Healey, 2000. \"}]"],"_version_":1853670548893073408,"timestamp":"2026-01-07T14:59:53.477Z","digital_description":["[{\"file_url\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0095_back.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Jerome Rothenberg Tape Box - Back\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0006_11_0095_front.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0095_front.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Jerome Rothenberg Tape Box - Front\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0006_11_0095_side.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0095_side.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Jerome Rothenberg Tape Box - Spine\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0006_11_0095_tape.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0095_tape.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Jerome Rothenberg Tape Box - Reel\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://files.spokenweb.ca/concordia/sgw/audio/all_mp3/jerome_rothenberg_i006-11-095.mp3\",\"file_path\":\"files.spokenweb.ca>concordia>sgw>audio>all_mp3\",\"filename\":\"jerome_rothenberg_i006-11-095.mp3\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"01:27:32\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"210.1 MB\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"George Bowering\\n00:00:00\\nI'm glad we got this room. Welcome back to the first night of the fourth year of our series. And for those of you who are here for the first time, welcome you too. I'm really glad that we could start off with Jerome Rothenberg [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1775056], especially from my own personal viewpoint, because while Jerome Rothenberg is one of the names that I've paid a lot of attention to, and one of the names that poets have paid attention to over the last decade, this'll be the first time that I've been able to hear him read, too. Usually when, often when us people from the West think about the new American poetry, we tend to think of it in terms of people from outposts such as New Mexico [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1522], and Utah, [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q829] and San Francisco [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q62], and so on. And we forget that New York City [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q60] is one of the centre-place, central-places, so that it can produce poets such as Joel Oppenheimer [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6213806] who will be here in the following spring, and Paul Blackburn [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q7149388], who was here a couple of years ago. Jerome Rothenberg has always been the centre, in the centre of that scene, and not only as one of the principal poets, but as editor, and publisher, and so on and so forth, especially with a very important magazine of the 1960's called some--oblique thing [some/thing]. And he's especially interesting to me too because of the kind of work that produced a book such as Technicians of the Sacred, a compilation of the poetries from various oral traditions around the world, and a similar sort of impulse has always been at the centre of his work too. I'd also like to correct a mistake on the little printed page that wasn't really mine, that I picked up from somewhere else and couldn't quite believe myself, that said that Jerome Rothenberg was born in 1921. All I can say is that he was born sometime between the death of Lord Byron [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q5679] and now. [Laughter]. But I'm pretty certain that he wasn't around in 1921. So I'd like you to give a welcome to Jerome Rothenberg.\\n \\nAudience\\n00:02:53\\nApplause.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:02:58\\nThe birthdate'll come clearer in the second part of the reading. I'll read in two parts. And in the first set, what I'll be reading are translations and re-workings of American Indian poetry, which have been important to me over the last five or six years. And I'll start with some which are based on earlier translations, re-workings of material previously translated, and then as I get into it, some translations that result from direct contact and direct experience of American Indian poetry. This is an Aztec poem. The first four or five, six poems will be Aztec or Mexican in origin, and the theme will be flowers.  \\\"Offering Flowers\\\".\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:04:24\\nReads \\\"Offering Flowers\\\" [from Technicians of the Sacred].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:07:37\\nThis is Aztec, too, in origin, translated through the Spanish.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:07:52\\nReads “A Song of Chalco” [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:09:53\\nAnd it doesn't die out, even with the destruction that follows, and flowers are picked up again, this in a series of translations, again through the Spanish, of a series of Peyote songs, from the Huichol Indians of central Mexico [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q96]. The name Wirikuta [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q8026952] is the name given to the place of the gods, and the spiritual place of the Peyote. The Peyote is described as the rose, it's described as the corn, the maize, it's described under a number of images, and through the figure, the mythological figure of one called the Blue Stag. This is the first Huichol, Peyote song.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:10:46\\nReads “First Peyote Song” [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:11:46.19\\n\\\"Song of an Initiate\\\".\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:11:51\\nReads \\\"Song of an Initiate\\\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:12:25\\nAnd this is a poem called \\\"How the Violin Was Born: A Peyote Account”.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:12:35\\nReads \\\"How the Violin was Born: A Peyote Account” [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:13:24\\nThese are a few short Indian pieces. Not poems but part of what's connected with the whole activity of poetry, among the tribal peoples. Which is more than an activity of words; which goes beyond language. And these are the events that accompany the words. And the first is an Iroquois dream event. \\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:13:58\\nReads [\\\"Dream Event 1\\\", published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:14:08\\nThese are a series of vision events. The first two are Eskimo.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:14:14\\nReads \\\"Vision Event I\\\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n\\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:14:25\\nReads \\\"Vision Event 2\\\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:14:39\\nAnd this is a Sioux Indian vision event.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:14:43\\nReads \\\"Vision Event 3\\\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:15:01\\nThis is a Kwakiutl Indian gift event. All the words are from Kwakiut'l Indians. It's either spoken in English or translated into English. The Kwakiut'l, like other Northwest Coast people, celebrate the potlatch, you know, which is not always terrible or distasteful in its consequences. This is benevolent gift-giving. \\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:15:26\\nReads \\\"Gift Event [2]\\\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:16:32\\nThese are a series of seven Navajo animal songs. \\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:16:42\\nReads \\\"Navajo Animal Songs\\\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:17:49\\nThe next few are from a series of translations I've been doing, are called, well, it's the Seneca Indian word for one of their major curing ceremonies, a term for a major curing ceremony, \\\"Shaking the Pumpkin\\\", because the pumpkin rattle, the big pumpkin rattle is the major instrument used in this. Or it's got a more ornate name, it's called \\\"The Society of the Mystic Animals\\\". The man, Richard Johnny John, Indian, who is working with me on this, explained it's a serious ceremony, he said, but if everything's alright, the one who says the prayer tells them, I leave it up to you, folks, and if you want to have a good time, have a good time. Well everything's alright in the translations, you know, so one eases up there. The translations are done trying to follow everything in the Seneca, including the meaning of the sounds, the hey-ya and the way-oh-hey, that are very common in Indian poetry. Basically the way I do it is to present them visually on the page, and I can't do this in reading them, so I'm just going to select out of these poems that read easily. The purpose is curing, and well-being. \\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:19:34\\nReads [\\\"Caw Caw the Crows Caw Caw\\\" published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:19:49\\nReads \\\"Two more about a crow, in the manner of Zukofsky\\\" [later published in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:20:05\\nThree poems about the owl, on the page, the vocables, the sounds, make the figure of an owl, even as in the singing of the song, the sound of the owl comes through. But here are just the words.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:20:19\\nReads \\\"The Owl: One\\\".\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:20:25\\nReads \\\"The Owl: Two\\\".\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:20:32\\nReads \\\"The Owl: Three\\\".\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:20:40\\n\\\"A Song of My Song, In Three Parts”.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:20:45\\nReads \\\"A Song of My Song, In Three Parts\\\" [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:20:59\\nReads “Three Ways to Screw Up on Your Way to the Doings” [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:21:16\\nBuckets are important, to bring back soup and...The last one from this series.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:21:31\\nReads “Where the Song Went Where She Went & What Happened When they Met” [published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:22:15\\nThe next are a little harder to do, but I hope I make it. The Senecas don't use many words. It's a kind of minimal poetry and the power is in the compression. The Navajos use more words, the poetry gets dense, and in addition they use many many non-verbal sounds. And in addition, they distort many of the words in the singing. So that if you translate just for the meaning, you're only getting a small part of what the Navajo is doing. And then in addition, everything is sung in the Navajo. So I began to translate a series called, because that's what they are, \\\"The Seventeen Horse Songs of Frank Mitchell\\\". Seventeen horse-blessing, horse-curing songs that were the property of a Navajo medicine man named Frank Mitchell. And the problem that came up for me, I couldn't translate just for meaning, I wanted to, you know, consider all of the factors that went into the poem. So I began to insert sounds corresponding to the sound of the English words as the Navajo had the meaning of the sounds, and to distort the words. And then it seemed to me that it was necessary to carry this further, to begin to sing the songs as well. Which came to me with great difficulty. But I've gotten through a number of them now, and what I'll do is sing one, the \\\"Tenth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell,\\\" and then do a tape for three voices of another one of the horse songs. You'll notice the words are rather similar from one to another, the melody changes. In this, and the Navajos of course would know this, the hero, Enemy-Slayer, has gone to the house of his father, the sun up there, to bring back horses for the people. And in this Tenth Horse Song, it's mostly the father, the sun, speaking, telling him to bring the horses back to the house of his mother, you know, who everybody understands to be Changing Woman. Bring it back to the earth. And sometimes the voice of Enemy-Slayer comes into it.  But the basic refrain is to \\\"go to the woman, go to her.\\\" \\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:25:24\\nPerforms \\\"Tenth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell\\\" [from The 17 Horse-Songs of Frank Mitchell]. \\n \\nAudience\\n00:31:25\\nApplause.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:31:38\\nThe next one, and I guess the last piece in the first set, is the \\\"Twelfth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell\\\". The melody changes. Some of the distortions change. The burden changes, and now Enemy-Slayer contemplates the horses coming back to earth with him, in the same sequence. This is done on tape, with three voices. I think that's about all there is to say about it. Three voices.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:32:23\\nPlays recording of \\\"Twelfth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell\\\", sung by three voices [from The 17 Horse-Songs of Frank Mitchell and published later in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nAudience\\n00:39:42\\nApplause.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:39:48\\nIn fact, let me end this set with a live poem, I don't want to end with a machine. This is another Aztec poem called \\\"The Flight of Quetzalcoatl\\\". The plumed serpent, bird-snake man. In which he discovers that he's become old, and leaves and goes on a long journey, and is reborn as the morning star.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:40:39\\nReads \\\"The Flight of Quetzalcoatl\\\" [later published in Shaking the Pumpkin].\\n \\nAudience\\n00:47:17\\nApplause. \\n \\nUnknown\\n00:47:20\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n \\nGeorge Bowering\\n00:47:20\\nOkay, we'll hold for about ten minutes, and open the doors and get cool, and then come back. \\n \\nUnknown\\n00:47:27\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:47:28\\nThe second set will be a straight reading, whatever that means, from a long series of poems called \\\"Poland/1931\\\". A series of ancestral poems. So Poland [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q36] is where the ancestors come from, for some number, hundreds of years. And that is Jewish Poland. And 1931, rather than 1921, is the year of my birth. And it's in a sense, though I don't keep to it too strictly, everything before that. To try to build up a world that I really don't know.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:48:29\\nReads \\\"Poland/1931: The Wedding\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:50:46\\nReads \\\"The King of the Jews\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:51:52\\nThe next one's called \\\"The Key of Solomon\\\". It's the name of a medieval, a series of medieval magical books that were supposed to go back to the times of Solomon [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q37085]. \\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:57:07\\nReads \\\"The Key of Solomon\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:53:42\\n\\\"The Beadle's Testimony.\\\" Because beadles were a demon.\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:53:47\\nReads \\\"The Beadle's Testimony\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:54:53\\nTwo poems called \\\"Soap\\\".\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:54:57\\nReads \\\"Soap \\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:55:56\\nReads \\\"Soap II” [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:57:37\\nReads \\\"The Rabbi's Testimony\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n00:59:08\\nReads \\\"The Connoisseur of Jews\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:00:38\\nReads \\\"The Beards\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:03:32\\nReads \\\"The Mothers I\\\" [from Poland/1931]. \\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:04:08\\nReads \\\"The Mothers II\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:04:43\\nReads \\\"The Mothers III\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:05:19\\nReads \\\"Milk & Honey I\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:06:00\\nReads \\\"Milk & Honey II\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:06:31\\nReads \\\"Ancestral Scenes\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:07:09\\nReads \\\"The Fathers\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:09:10\\nThis one is called \\\"Portrait of the Jew, Old Country Style\\\".\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:09:16\\nReads \\\"Poland, 1931: Portrait of the Jew, Old Country Style\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:11:51\\nThis is a longer one, called \\\"The Student's Testimony\\\"\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:12:04\\nReads \\\"The Student's Testimony\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:17:49\\nA somewhat shorter one, and then another long one, and then a quite short one and that's...that's it. \\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:17:58\\nReads \\\"The Brothers\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:20:10\\nReads \\\"The Steward's Testimony\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n\\nAudience\\n01:25:15\\nLaughter and applause [faint].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:25:20\\nNow, I'll end it with, I'll end it with two poems. \\\"A Poem for the Christians\\\". It's partly to...[Audience laughter]...it's a found poem from the prayer book. But you can see where there are changes, you know. [Audience laughter].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:25:42\\nReads \\\"A Poem for the Christians\\\" [from Poland/1931].\\n \\nJerome Rothenberg\\n01:26:45\\nReads \\\"Fish and Paradise\\\".\\n \\nEND\\n01:27:32\\n[Cut off abruptly].\",\"notes\":\"Jerome Rothenberg reads poems published later in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972) and from Poland/1931 (Unicorn Press, 1969).\\n\\nRachel has indexed poems.\\n00:00- George Bowering introduces Jerome Rothenberg. [INDEX: room, first night of fourth year of the series, poets, West, New American Poetry, New Mexico, Utah, San Francisco, New York City, Joel Oppenheimer, Paul Blackburn, editor, publisher, Some CH Oblique Thing [unknown 1960’s magazine], Technicians of the Sacred, oral traditions worldwide, pamphlet mistake: Rothenberg not born in 1921, Lord Byron.]\\n02:58- Jerome Rothenberg introduces reading and “Offering Flowers”. [INDEX: birthdate, two-part reading, translations or re-workings of American Indian poetry, direct contact, direct experience with American Indians, Aztec poem, Mexican, theme of flowers; unknown source.]\\n04:24- Reads “Offering Flowers”. [INDEX: translation, Aztec, Mexico, flower, feast, offering, morning, temple, spiritual, god, dance, repetition, anaphora, food, drink, word]\\n07:37- Introduces “A Song of Chalco”. [INDEX: Aztec in origin, translated to Spanish; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n07:52- Reads “A Song of Chalco”. [INDEX: rose, fire, god, house, bird, thrush,   song, poet, forest, flower, dance, lust, father, prince, joy, son, body, river.]\\n09:53- Introduces first line “First Peyote Song”. [INDEX: die out, destruction, flowers, translations, Spanish, Peyote songs, Huichol Indians of central Mexico, Wiricota, gods,        spiritual place of the Peyote, rose, the corn, the maize, images, mythological figure called Blue Stag, Huichol; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n10:46- Reads first line “First Peyote Song” . [INDEX: rose, birth, flower, wind, eternal, god, mountain, mother, house, heart, Peyote, Blue Stag, rain, maize, earth, Aztec, Mexico, song.]\\n11:46- Reads “Song of an Initiate”. [INDEX: rose, song, god, stair, sky, silence; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n12:25- Introduces “How the Violin Was Born: A Peyote Account”. [INDEX: peyote account; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n12:35- Reads “How the Violin Was Born”. [INDEX: music, violin, wood, cedar, stone, tree, heart, soul, Big Stag, bird, song, wind.]\\n13:24- Introduces “Dream Event I”. [INDEX: Indian pieces, whole activity of poetry, tribal peoples, activity of words, beyond language, events that accompany words, Iroquois dream-event; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n13:58- Reads “Dream Event I\\\". [INDEX: aboriginal, dream, community,         \\tinterpretation, theatre.]\\n14:08- Introduces “Vision Event I”. [INDEX: ‘Eskimo’; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n14:14- Reads “Vision Event I”. [INDEX: aboriginal, Eskimo, solitude, stone, circle, place, time, ritual.]\\n14:25- Reads “Vision Event II”. [INDEX: aboriginal, Eskimo, vision, hanging, sight; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n14:39- Introduces “Vision Event III”. [INDEX: Sioux Indian.]\\n14:43- Reads “Vision Event III”. [INDEX: American Indian, aboriginal, vision, crying, sight; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n15:01- Introduces “Gift Event” [INDEX: Kwakiut’l Indian gift event, English, translation,        Northwest Coast people, celebrate the potlatch, consequences, benevolent; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n15:26- Reads “Gift Event”. [INDEX: Kwakiut'l, giving, gift, potlatch, Northwest, coast, aboriginal, animal, ritual, house, sound, value, name.]\\n16:32- Introduces “Seven Navajo Animal Songs”.\\n16:42- Reads “Seven Navajo Animal Songs”. [INDEX: animal, chipmunk, action, movement, mole, sex, wildcat, water, turkey, madness, scatological, pinion jay, bird; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n17:49- Introduces “Caw Caw the Crows Caw”. [INDEX: Seneca Indian word, curing ceremony “Shaking the pumpkin”, instrument, “The Society of the Mystic Animals”, Richard Johnny-John Indian, serious ceremony, prayer, translations, meanings of sounds, Indian poetry, visual presentation of sound, curing, well-being; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n19:34- Reads “Caw Caw the Crows Caw”.  [INDEX: Seneca, aboriginal, crow, movement; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n19:49- Reads  “Two more about a crow, in the manner of Zukofsky...”.  [INDEX: Louis Zukofsky, sound, Seneca, aboriginal later published in Shaking the Pumpkin      (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n20:05- Introduces “The Owl: One”. [INDEX: page, vocables, sounds, figure, singing of song, \\tsound of the owl.]\\n20:19- Reads “The Owl: One”. [INDEX: Seneca, aboriginal, owl, home, tree, hemlock]\\n20:25- Reads “The Owl: Two”.  [INDEX: Seneca, aboriginal, cure, sickness, poison, owl]\\n20:32- Reads “The Owl: Three”. [INDEX: Seneca, aboriginal, owl, tree, sound, whistle.]\\n20:40- Reads “A Song of My Song”. [INDEX: three parts, song, distance, circle, room,   proximity, sound; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n20:59- Reads “Three Ways to Screw Up on Your Way to the Doings”. [INDEX: later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972)\\n21:16- Introduces “Where the Song Went Where She Went & What Happened When they Met”. [INDEX: buckets, soup, last of series; later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n21:31- Reads “Where the Song Went Where She Went & What Happened When they Met”\\n22:15- Introduces “Tenth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell”. [INDEX: Senecas, words, minimal poetry, power in compression, Navajo poetry, non-verbal sounds, distort words when sung, translation, meaning, series, horse-blessing, horse-curing songs, Navajo medicine man Frank Mitchell, problem translating, insert sounds, English, sing, tape of three voices of horse song, melody, hero, Enemy-Slayer, father’s house, sun, people, mother, Changing Woman, earth, refrain “go to the woman, go to her”.]\\n25:24- Reads/Sings “Tenth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell”.\\n31:38- Introduces “Twelfth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell”. [INDEX: melody change, distortions change, burden changes, Enemy-Slayer, horses, earth, sequence, three voices, later published in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n32:23- Plays recording of “Twelfth Horse Song of Frank Mitchell”.\\n39:48- Introduces “The Flight of the Quetzalcoatl”. [INDEX: live poem, machine, Aztec poem, plumed serpent, bird-snake-man, old, long journey, morning star; published later in Shaking the Pumpkin (Doubleday, 1972).]\\n40:39- Reads “The Flight of the Quetzalcoatl”.\\n47:20- George Bowering introduces break.\\n47:27.02- END OF RECORDING.\\n\\n00:00- Jerome Rothenberg introduces long poem “Poland 1931”. [INDEX: long poem, ancestral poems, Jewish Poland, year of Rothenberg’s birth, world unknown.]\\n01:02- Reads “Poland, 1931: The Wedding”.\\n03:19- Reads “Poland, 1931: The King of Jews”.\\n04:25- Introduces “Poland, 1931: The Key of Solomon”. [INDEX: medieval magical books.]\\n04:40- Reads “Poland, 1931: The Key of Solomon”.\\n06:15- Introduces “Poland, 1931: The Beetle’s Testimony”. [INDEX: beetles, demon.]\\n06:20- Reads “Poland, 1931: The Beetle’s Testimony”.\\n07:26- Introduces “Poland, 1931: Soap”. [INDEX: two poems called “Soap”.]\\n07:30- Reads “Poland, 1931: Soap I”.\\n08:29- Reads “Poland, 1931: Soap II”.\\n10:10- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: The Rabbi's Testimony\\\"\\n11:41- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: The Connoisseur of Jews\\\"\\n13:11- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: The Beards\\\"\\n16:05- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: The Mothers I\\\"  \\n16:41- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: The Mothers II\\\"\\n17:16- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: The Mothers III\\\"\\n17:52- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: Milk and Honey I\\\"\\n18:33- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: Milk and Honey II\\\"\\n19:04- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: Ancestral Scenes\\\"\\n19:42- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: The Fathers\\\"\\n21:43- Introduces \\\"Poland, 1931: Portrait of the Jew, Old Country Style\\\"\\n21:49- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: Portrait of the Jew, Old Country Style\\\"\\n24:24- Introduces \\\"Poland, 1931: The Student's Testimony\\\"\\n24:37- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: The Student's Testimony\\\"\\n30:31- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: The Brothers\\\"\\n32:43- Reads \\\"Poland, 1931: The Steward's Testimony\\\"\\n37:53- Introduces “A Poem for the Christians”. [INDEX: found poem in prayer book.]\\n38:15- Reads \\\"A Poem for the Christians\\\"\\n39:18- Reads \\\"Fish and Paradise\\\"\\n00:40:05.58- END OF RECORDING\",\"title\":\"\",\"credit\":\"\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Sound Recording\",\"featured\":\"Yes\",\"public_access_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/sgw-poetry-readings/jerome-rothenberg-at-sgwu-1969/\"}]"],"score":2.9979138},{"id":"1281","cataloger_name":["Mahtab,Banihashemi"],"partnerInstitution":["Concordia University"],"collection_source_collection":["SGWU Reading Series-Concordia University Department of English fonds"],"source_collection_label":["SGWU Reading Series-Concordia University Department of English fonds"],"collection_contributing_unit":["Records Management and Archives"],"source_collection_uri":[""],"collection_image_url":[""],"collection_source_collection_description":["The fonds consists of some administrative records of the SGWU Department of English and the Concordia Department of English between 1971 and 2000. It also consists of some SGWU Department of English records related to student academic activities in the 1940s and to public readings and lectures, and a few interviews, produced between 1966 and 1972. The fonds mainly includes minutes of departmental meetings and some course timetables. It also includes some student papers in bound volumes and 63 sound recordings (80 audio reels) mainly composed of poetry readings (see the Concordia SpokenWeb project which uses this material) but also a few lectures given at SGWU. There are also loose typed sheets describing some of the SGWU poetry readings."],"collection_source_collection_id":["I086"],"persistent_url":["http://archives.concordia.ca/I086"],"item_title":["Allen Ginsberg at Sir George Williams University, The Poetry Series, 7 November 1969"],"item_title_source":["Cataloguer"],"item_title_note":["\"ALAN GINSBERG -1 Recorded November 7, 1969 3.75 ips on 1 mil. tape, 1/2 track\" written on sticker on the back of the tape's box. ALAN GINSBERG refers to Allen Ginsberg. ALAN is mispelled. \"PERMISSION FROM HOWARD FINK TO REPRODUCE THIS TAPE\" also written on sticker on the back of the tape's box. \"ALAN GINSBERG-1 I006/SR33.1\" written on sticker on the spine of the tape's box. \"I006-11-033.1\" written on sticker on the reel.\n\n\"ALAN GINSBERG -2 Recorded November 7, 1969 3.75 ips on 1 mil. tape, 1/2 track\" written on sticker on the back of the tape's box. ALAN GINSBERG refers to Allen Ginsberg. ALAN is mispelled. \"PERMISSION FROM HOWARD FINK TO REPRODUCE THIS TAPE\" also written on sticker on the back of the tape's box. \"ALAN GINSBERG-1 I006/SR33.2\" written on sticker on the spine of the tape's box. \"ALAN GINSBERG-1 I006-11-033.2\" written on sticker on the reel."],"item_language":["English"],"item_production_context":["Documentary recording"],"item_series_title":["The Poetry Series"],"item_subseries_title":["Poetry 4"],"item_identifiers":["[I006-11-033.1, I006-11-033.2]"],"creator_names":["Ginsberg, Irwin Allen"],"creator_names_search":["Ginsberg, Irwin Allen"],"creators":["[{\"url\":\"http://viaf.org/viaf/108417923\",\"name\":\"Ginsberg, Irwin Allen\",\"dates\":\"1926-1997 \",\"notes\":\"Poet, revolutionary, and Beat generation icon Allen Ginsberg was born on June 3, 1926 in Paterson, New Jersey, to Naomi, a radical communist, and Louis Ginsberg, teacher and lyric poet. In his early life, Ginsberg’s mother was diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia, a condition that would forever shape her son’s life. After graduation from high school, Ginsberg was accepted to Columbia University on scholarship to study labor law. However, after meeting Mark Van Doren and Lionel Trilling, Ginsberg turned to English and poetry. It was also at this time when he met Jack Kerouac, Lucien Carr, William S. Burroughs and Neal Cassady who would eventually form the ‘Beat Generation’. In 1948, Ginsberg had a vision of poet William Blake entering his apartment window, an event which would influence the rest of his life, attempting to recapture the image. In 1949, Ginsberg had a few minor run-ins with the law and he was committed to the Columbia-Presbyterian Psychiatric Institution. There he met his future publisher and life-long friend, Carl Solomon, a troubled intellectual. After serving in the merchant marines, and spending several months in Mexico, Ginsberg moved to San Francisco, where he met poets Kenneth Rexroth, Gary Snyder and Peter Orlovsky, who would become his life-long partner. After composing his first major notable poem, “Howl”, in 1955, he and Rexroth organized a reading of it at the Six Gallery, featuring Snyder and Michael McClure, with Lawrence Ferlenghetti (who later published the poem) and Kerouac in attendance. Ginsberg’s first collection of poetry was published in 1956, but with its second printing in 1957, Howl and Other Poems (City Lights Books, 1956) was seized by U.S. Customs for being ‘obscene’. However, after a trial, the book was deemed to have literary merit, which propelled Ginsberg and the Beat group of poets into instant fame, giving Ginsberg the opportunity to promote Kerouac’s On the Road and Burroughs’ Naked Lunch. In 1956, Ginsberg received news that his mother had died, which compelled him to write the poems “Death to Van Gogh’s Ear!” and “The Lion for Real”, and Kaddish and Other Poems (City Lights Books, 1961) as well as Empty Mirror: Early Poems (Corinth Books, 1961). During the 1960s Ginsberg traveled widely with Burroughs, Gregory Corso, Snyder to Paris, India, Tangier, Prague (where he was deported for being a corrupting influence). He published  Reality Sandwiches: 1953-1960 (City Lights Books, 1963), The Yage Letters with William Burroughs (City Lights Books, 1963), TV Baby Poems (Beach Books, 1968), Angkor Wat (Fulcrum Press, 1968), Planet News (City Lights Books, 1968), and Airplane Dreams: Compositions from Journals (City Lights Books, 1969). The years of 1968 and 1969 were filled with mourning for Ginsberg, as he learned of the death of both Neal Cassady and Jack Kerouac. The 1970s saw Ginsberg publish a number of collections, including The Fall of America: Poems of These States (City Lights, 1972), which won the National Book Award in 1974, The Gates of Wrath: Rhymed Poems, 1948-1952 (Grey Fox, 1972), Iron Horse (City Lights, 1974), First Blues: Rags, Ballads and Harmonium Songs, 1971-1974 (Full Court Press, 1975), Mind Breaths: Poems (City Lights, 1977), Poems All Over the Place: Mostly Seventies (Cherry Valley Editions, 1978). In 1976, Ginsberg and poet Anne Waldman were invited to create a writing program at the Naropa Institute in Colorado, which they named the Jack Kerouac School of Disembodied Poetics. In the 1980s and 1990s, Ginsberg published Plutonian Ode and Other Poems, 1977-1980 (City Lights, 1982), White Shroud: Poems 1980-1985 (Harper & Row, 1986), Cosmopolitan Greetings: Poems, 1986-1992 (HarperCollins,1994), Selected Poems (HarperCollins, 1996), Death & Fame: Last Poems, 1993-1997 (HarperFlamingo, 1999). Until his death, Ginsberg used his fame and poetry to speak out against censorship, the Vietnam War and drug prohibition, and for gay rights. Allen Ginsberg died in New York City, on April 4th, 1997.\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Author\",\"Performer\"]}]"],"contributors_names":["Bowering, George"],"contributors_names_search":["Bowering, George"],"contributors":["[{\"url\":\"http://viaf.org/viaf/34469976\",\"name\":\"Bowering, George\",\"dates\":\"1935-\",\"notes\":\"\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Series organizer\",\"Presenter\"]}]"],"Presenter_name":["Bowering, George"],"Series_organizer_name":["Bowering, George"],"Performance_Date":[1969],"material_description":["[{\"side\":\"\",\"image\":\"\",\"other\":\"\",\"extent\":\"1/4 inch\",\"AV_types\":\"Audio\",\"tape_brand\":\"Scotch\",\"generations\":\"\",\"Conservation\":\"\",\"equalization\":\"\",\"playback_mode\":\"Mono\",\"playing_speed\":\"3 3/4 ips\",\"sound_quality\":\"Excellent\",\"recording_type\":\"Analogue\",\"storage_capacity\":\"\",\"physical_condition\":\"\",\"track_configuration\":\"Half-track\",\"material_designation\":\"Reel to Reel\",\"physical_composition\":\"Magnetic Tape\",\"accompanying_material\":\"\",\"other_physical_description\":\"\"},{\"side\":\"\",\"image\":\"\",\"other\":\"\",\"extent\":\"1/4 inch\",\"AV_types\":\"Audio\",\"tape_brand\":\"\",\"generations\":\"\",\"Conservation\":\"\",\"equalization\":\"\",\"playback_mode\":\"Mono\",\"playing_speed\":\"3 3/4 ips\",\"sound_quality\":\"Excellent\",\"recording_type\":\"Analogue\",\"storage_capacity\":\"\",\"physical_condition\":\"\",\"track_configuration\":\"Half-track\",\"material_designation\":\"Reel to Reel\",\"physical_composition\":\"Magnetic Tape\",\"accompanying_material\":\"\",\"other_physical_description\":\"\"}]"],"material_designations":["Reel to Reel","Reel to Reel"],"physical_compositions":["Magnetic Tape","Magnetic Tape"],"recording_type":["Analogue","Analogue"],"AV_type":["Audio","Audio"],"playback_mode":["Mono","Mono"],"Dates":["[{\"date\":\"1969 11 7\",\"type\":\"Performance Date\",\"notes\":\"Date written on sticker on the back of the tape's box.\",\"source\":\"Accompanying Material\"}]"],"Location":["[{\"url\":\"https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/22080570\",\"venue\":\"Hall Building Room H-110\",\"notes\":\"Previous researcher\",\"address\":\"1455, Boul de Maisonneuve Ouest, Montreal, Quebec, Canada\",\"latitude\":\"45.4972758\",\"longitude\":\"-73.57893043\"}]"],"Address":["1455, Boul de Maisonneuve Ouest, Montreal, Quebec, Canada"],"Venue":["Hall Building Room H-110"],"City":["Montreal, Quebec"],"content_notes":["Allen Ginsberg reads from Angkor Wat (Fulcrum Press, 1968), Planet News (City Lights Books, 1968), as well as pieces that were published later in The Fall of America: Poems of These States (City Lights Books, 1973). Ginsbger also performs musical versions of William Blake’s Songs of Innocence and Songs of Experience, recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience (MGM, 1970). "],"contents":["allen_ginsberg_i006-11-033-1.mp3 [File 1 of 2]\n \nUnnamed Performers and Audience\n00:00:00\nSing and chant accompanied by music . \n \nUnknown\n00:16:38\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n \nGeorge Bowering\n00:16:41\nWelcome to the...welcome to the fourth—third week of the fourth series of our readings here at Sir George [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q326342] and this one is a special one, partly in that it was, it is being presented by a combination of the daytime Arts Student Association and the evening Arts Student Association, and not simply on the normal schedule. I'm certain that you don't have to be told who Allen Ginsberg [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6711] is, and you might think on how lucky it is that you happen to be in Montreal [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q340] and he is here at the same time. Last night he was at York University [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q849751] in Toronto [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q172], and tomorrow he's going to be in Ottawa [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1930], and we're going to sap an awful lot of his energy. Allen is, I think, the most noted poet we've had over the last couple of decades, in the world, and as you're going to find out and as you already know, one of the super-poets in terms of writing poetry, as well. I'd like to give you, without any more cogitation, Mr. Allen Ginsberg. \n\nAudience\n00:18:13\nApplause.\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:18:23\nGeorge Bowering [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1239280], who I've known a long time, asked me to read a poem that I haven't read through but once before, called \"Angkor Wat\". So I'll try that. It's middle-sized, like, ten minutes, probably. What it is, is notations taken down in the course of one night in Cambodia [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q424], in Siem Reap [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q11711], which is outside of Angkor Wat [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q43473], a town outside of the ruins.\n \nUnknown\n00:18:55\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:18:56\nReads \"Angkor Wat\" [from Angkor Wat]. \n \nAudience\n00:41:32\nApplause [cut off].\n \nUnknown\n00:41:37\nSilence [cut or edit made in tape].  \n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:41:45\nI want to read a couple poems from a book published in Toronto by Anansi Press, or one poem from that. This is written in Saigon [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1854], so it's about a week, yes it's about...the same week, I think. Oh this is...a week before. \n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:42:19\nReads “Understand that this is a Dream” [from Airplane Dreams].\n \nUnknown\n00:49:28\nSilence [cut or edit made in tape].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:49:36\nI've been working on Blake's [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q41513] Songs of Innocence [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q20644964] and Experience [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q27890603], making tunes, or tuning the songs, so I'd like to sing some. \n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:49:48\nPerforms \"(a) Introduction / (b) The Shepherd”, accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience]. \n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:52:30\nSinging them in the order in Experience, that they're in the book, what follows is \"The Echoing Green\".\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:52:40\nPerforms \"The Echoing Green\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience]. \n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:54:29\n“The Little Boy Lost\" and \"The Little Boy Found\".\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:54:41\nPerforms \"The Little Boy Lost\" and \"The Little Boy Found\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience]. \n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:56:14\nPerforms \"The Blossom\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience]. \n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:57:16\nFrom Experience, the first song is \"Hear the Voice of the Bard\".\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:57:22\nPerforms \"Hear the Voice of the Bard\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later as “Introduction” on Songs of Innocence and Experience]. \n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:59:26\nAnd the last song in Experience...\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:59:33\nPerforms \"Introduction\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n01:00:47.46\nAnd last from Innocence, \"The Laughing Song\".\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n01:00:50\nPerforms \"The Laughing Song\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later as “b) Laughing Song” on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\n \nAudience\n01:01:48\nApplause [cut off].\n\nEND\n01:01:52\n\n\nallen_ginsberg_i006-11-033-2.mp3 [File 2 of 2] \n\nAllen Ginsberg\n00:00:00\nReads \"Morning\" [from Planet News]. \n \nAudience\n00:02:17\nLaughter and applause.\n \nUnknown\n00:02:23\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:02:23\nReads \"Today\" [from Planet News]. \n \nAudience\n00:10:04\nApplause.\n \nUnknown\n00:10:07\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:10:08\nReads \"First party at Ken Kesey's with Hell's Angels\" [from Planet News]. \n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:11:22\nReads \"Uptown\" [from Planet News]. \n \nAudience\n00:12:20\nLaughter and applause\n \nUnknown\n00:12:29\n[Cut or edit made in tape].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:12:30\nPerforms \"Holy Ghost on the Nod over the Body of Bliss\" [from Planet News]. \n \nAudience\n00:14:46\nApplause.\n \nUnknown\n00:14:52\nSilence [cut or edit made in tape].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:14:59\nPerforms \"Hari Om Namah Shivaya” chant, accompanying himself on harmonium. \n \nAudience\n00:25:17\nApplause.\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:25:22\nPerforms \"The Lamb\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:27:00\nPerforms \"The Little Black Boy\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:30:11\nPerforms \"Holy Thursday\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:31:37\nI'll finish the Blake with \"The Nurse's Song\". Get up a little closer to me.\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:31:52\nPerforms\"The Nurse's Song\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later as “Nurses Song” on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:32:27\nNo...start again.\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:32:32\nPerforms \"The Nurse's Song\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later as “Nurses Song” on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\n \nAudience\n00:35:58\nApplause.\n \nUnknown\n00:36:05\nSilence [cut or edit made in tape].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:36:13\nThe continuation of a long poem on these dates. Some of those who are specialists, some of those who are specialists in poesy will know a text published in a book I've been reading from, Planet News [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q7201132], called \"Wichita Vortex Sutra\". This is the continuation of the same long poem a year later, bringing the war, the mental war up to 1967. January, 1967. Related to the poem \"Wichita Vortex Sutra\" in that it's crossing the central part of the United States [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q30] again, north of Kansas [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1558] through Nebraska [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1553], passing again by Lincoln [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q28260], Nebraska. A trip between Wichita, Kansas and Lincoln, Nebraska two...a year and a half earlier having been the subject of the text \"Wichita Vortex Sutra\". This continuation.\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:37:09\nReads [“Returning North of Vortex\", published later in The Fall of America: Poems of These States].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:43:12\nA continuation of the same poem, between Kansas City [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q41819] and St. Louis [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q38022]. Middle of the long poem on these dates.\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:43:22\nReads [\"Kansas City to Saint Louis\", published later in The Fall of America: Poems of These States].\n \nAudience\n00:52:41\nApplause.\n \nUnknown\n00:52:46\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:52:47\nReads \"Car Crash\" [published later in The Fall of America: Poems of These States; audience laughter throughout].\n\nAllen Ginsberg\n00:58:17\nAnd July 4th, 1969. \"Orange hawkeye\"--Hawkeye is a New York state [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1384] flower, a flower that grows in New York state, very tiny, bright orange, eyeball with a tiny brown, brownish, purplish pupil.\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n00:58:35\nReads [\"Independence Day\", published later in The Fall of America: Poems of These States]\n \nAllen Ginsberg\n01:00:49\nFinish with a mantra. Well or, read one last poem, which has been distributed by Dakota Broadsides, they're people from Logos, or connected with Logos, I think. Is that not right? Yeah. I'll pass these out, I think. It's a poem written in Grant Park [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q159085] on August 28th, '68, during the Democratic Convention. Uh, Grant Park, the day after the election of, or the day after the nomination of Humphrey [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q209989]. \n \nAllen Ginsberg\n01:01:27\nReads unnamed poem.\n \nAudience\n01:02:25\nApplause and laughter [cut off].\n \nEND\n01:02:31\n"],"Note":["[{\"note\":\"Year-Specific Information: \\n\\nIn 1969, Ginsberg had published Airplane Dreams: Compositions from Journals. In June of 1969, Ginsberg recorded a series of William Blake’s poetry set to music, which was released by MGM records in 1970. Close friend Jack Kerouac died on October 21, 1969, which prompted Allen to write his long elegy, “Memory Gardens”. In December, Ginsberg testified in court at the “Chicago Seven” trial of protesters in the 1968 Democratic National Convention.\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"Local Connections:\\n\\nAllen Ginsberg not only became a household name and a symbol for youth in North America during the 60’s and 70’s, he led the ‘Beat’ poetry movement, was a world traveler, a defender of civil and human rights, a teacher and spiritual guide. Ginsberg states in the recording that he had known George Bowering, who was a professor at Sir George Williams University, for “a long time” (I006-11-033.1).\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"George Bowering published his reaction to Ginsberg’s poem, “Howl” in 1969, How I hear Howl (Montreal, Beaver kosmos folio, 1, 1969).\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"Stephen Morrissey has recollections of attending most of the readings in the series: <http://www.vehiculepoets.com/recollective_essay.htm>\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"Original print catalogue, introduction, research and edits by Celyn Harding-Jones\\n\\nAdditional research and edits by Ali Barillaro\",\"type\":\"Cataloguer\"},{\"note\":\"2 reel-to-reel tapes>2 CDs>2 digital files\",\"type\":\"Preservation\"}]"],"Related_works":["[{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/oxford-companion-to-twentieth-century-poetry-in-english/oclc/807465072&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Butscher, Edward. \\\"Ginsberg, Allen\\\". The Oxford Companion to Twentieth-Century Poetry in English. Ian Hamilton, ed. Oxford University Press, 1996.\\n\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/oxford-encyclopedia-of-american-literature/oclc/769478515&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Carlise, Chuck. \\\"Ginsberg, Allen\\\". The Oxford Encyclopedia of American Literature. Jay Parini, ed. Oxford University Press 2004. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/ankor-wat/oclc/17611&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Ginsberg, Allen. Angkor Wat. London: Fulcrum Press, 1968. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/planet-news-1961-1967/oclc/806341370&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Ginsberg, Allen. Planet News. San Francisco: City Lights Books, 1968. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/fall-of-america-poems-of-these-states-1965-1971/oclc/472756006&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Ginsberg, Allen. The Fall of America: Poems of These States. San Francisco: City Lights Books, 1973.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q20713959\",\"citation\":\"Ginsberg, Allen. Songs of Innocence and Experience. New York: MGM, 1970. \"},{\"url\":\"http://www.writing.upenn.edu/~afilreis/50s/ginsberg-fbi.html\",\"citation\":\"Mitgang, Herbert. Dangerous dossiers: exposing the secret war against America’s greatest authors. New York: D.I. Fine, 1988.\"},{\"url\":\"http://www.allenginsberg.org\",\"citation\":\"Allen Ginsberg Project. The Allen Ginsberg Trust, 2010. \"},{\"url\":\"\",\"citation\":\"Duerden, Paul. “Ginsberg, Allen, 1926-”. Literature Online Biography. Proquest, 2008.   \"},{\"url\":\"\",\"citation\":\"“Nook: Ginsberg”. The Georgian. Montreal: Sir George Williams University, 12 November 1969, page 7.\"}]"],"_version_":1853670548896219136,"timestamp":"2026-01-07T14:59:53.477Z","digital_description":["[{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0006_11_0033-1_back.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0033-1_back.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Allen Ginsberg Tape Box 1 - Back\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0006_11_0033-1_front.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0033-1_front.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Allen Ginsberg Tape Box 1 - 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Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n \\nGeorge Bowering\\n00:16:41\\nWelcome to the...welcome to the fourth—third week of the fourth series of our readings here at Sir George [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q326342] and this one is a special one, partly in that it was, it is being presented by a combination of the daytime Arts Student Association and the evening Arts Student Association, and not simply on the normal schedule. I'm certain that you don't have to be told who Allen Ginsberg [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q6711] is, and you might think on how lucky it is that you happen to be in Montreal [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q340] and he is here at the same time. Last night he was at York University [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q849751] in Toronto [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q172], and tomorrow he's going to be in Ottawa [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1930], and we're going to sap an awful lot of his energy. Allen is, I think, the most noted poet we've had over the last couple of decades, in the world, and as you're going to find out and as you already know, one of the super-poets in terms of writing poetry, as well. I'd like to give you, without any more cogitation, Mr. Allen Ginsberg. \\n\\nAudience\\n00:18:13\\nApplause.\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:18:23\\nGeorge Bowering [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1239280], who I've known a long time, asked me to read a poem that I haven't read through but once before, called \\\"Angkor Wat\\\". So I'll try that. It's middle-sized, like, ten minutes, probably. What it is, is notations taken down in the course of one night in Cambodia [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q424], in Siem Reap [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q11711], which is outside of Angkor Wat [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q43473], a town outside of the ruins.\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:18:55\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:18:56\\nReads \\\"Angkor Wat\\\" [from Angkor Wat]. \\n \\nAudience\\n00:41:32\\nApplause [cut off].\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:41:37\\nSilence [cut or edit made in tape].  \\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:41:45\\nI want to read a couple poems from a book published in Toronto by Anansi Press, or one poem from that. This is written in Saigon [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1854], so it's about a week, yes it's about...the same week, I think. Oh this is...a week before. \\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:42:19\\nReads “Understand that this is a Dream” [from Airplane Dreams].\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:49:28\\nSilence [cut or edit made in tape].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:49:36\\nI've been working on Blake's [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q41513] Songs of Innocence [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q20644964] and Experience [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q27890603], making tunes, or tuning the songs, so I'd like to sing some. \\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:49:48\\nPerforms \\\"(a) Introduction / (b) The Shepherd”, accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience]. \\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:52:30\\nSinging them in the order in Experience, that they're in the book, what follows is \\\"The Echoing Green\\\".\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:52:40\\nPerforms \\\"The Echoing Green\\\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience]. \\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:54:29\\n“The Little Boy Lost\\\" and \\\"The Little Boy Found\\\".\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:54:41\\nPerforms \\\"The Little Boy Lost\\\" and \\\"The Little Boy Found\\\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience]. \\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:56:14\\nPerforms \\\"The Blossom\\\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience]. \\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:57:16\\nFrom Experience, the first song is \\\"Hear the Voice of the Bard\\\".\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:57:22\\nPerforms \\\"Hear the Voice of the Bard\\\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later as “Introduction” on Songs of Innocence and Experience]. \\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:59:26\\nAnd the last song in Experience...\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:59:33\\nPerforms \\\"Introduction\\\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n01:00:47.46\\nAnd last from Innocence, \\\"The Laughing Song\\\".\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n01:00:50\\nPerforms \\\"The Laughing Song\\\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later as “b) Laughing Song” on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\\n \\nAudience\\n01:01:48\\nApplause [cut off].\\n\\nEND\\n01:01:52\\n\",\"notes\":\"Allen Ginsberg reads from Angkor Wat (Fulcrum Press, 1968), Planet News (City Lights Books, 1968), as well as pieces that were published later in The Fall of America: Poems of These States (City Lights Books, 1973). Ginsbger also performs musical versions of William Blake’s Songs of Innocence and Songs of Experience, recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience (MGM, 1970). \\n                                              \\n00:00- Recording begins with Hare Krishna chanting music.\\n16:41- George Bowering introduces Allen Ginsberg. [INDEX: Sir George Williams University, third week of the fourth series of readings, reading presented with both daytime and evening Arts Student Association, Ginsberg’s reading schedule: York University (Toronto), Ottawa.]\\n18:23- Introduces “Angkor Wat”. [INDEX: George Bowering, notations taken from one night in Siem Reap, Cambodia; from Angkor Wat (Fulcrum Press, 1968).]\\n18:56- Reads “Angkor Wat”.\\n41:45- Introduces “Understand That This is a Dream”. [INDEX: Published by Anansi Press, Toronto; found in Airplane Dreams (City Lights Books, 1969).]\\n42:19- Reads “Understand That This is a Dream”.\\n49:36- Introduces Blake’s Songs of Innocence and Experience, poem beginning “Piping down the valleys wild”.\\n49:48- Sings (with harmonium-style instrument) “Piping down the valleys wild”.\\n51:20- Sings (with harmonium-style instrument) “How sweet is the shepherd’s sweet lot”.\\n52:30- Introduces “The Echoing Green” [INDEX: Blake’s Experience.]\\n52:40- Sings (with harmonium-style instrument) “The Echoing Green”.\\n54:29- Sings (with harmonium-style instrument) “The Little Boy Lost” and “The Little Boy Found”.\\n56:14- Sings (with harmonium-style instrument) “The Blossom”.\\n57:16- Introduces “Hear the Voice of the Bard” [INDEX: from Experience.]\\n57:22- Sings (with harmonium-style instrument) “Hear the Voice of the Bard”.\\n59:33- Sings (with harmonium-style instrument) “Youth of delight, come hither”.\\n1:00:47- Sings (with harmonium-style instrument) “The Laughing Song”\\n1:01:48.50- END OF RECORDING.\",\"title\":\"\",\"credit\":\"\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Sound Recording\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/sgw-poetry-readings/allen-ginsberg-at-sgwu-1969/#1\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://files.spokenweb.ca/concordia/sgw/audio/all_mp3/allen_ginsberg_i006-11-033-2.mp3\",\"file_path\":\"files.spokenweb.ca>concordia>sgw>audio>all_mp3\",\"filename\":\"allen_ginsberg_i006-11-033-2.mp3\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"66.6 MB\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"allen_ginsberg_i006-11-033-2.mp3 [File 2 of 2] \\n\\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:00:00\\nReads \\\"Morning\\\" [from Planet News]. \\n \\nAudience\\n00:02:17\\nLaughter and applause.\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:02:23\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:02:23\\nReads \\\"Today\\\" [from Planet News]. \\n \\nAudience\\n00:10:04\\nApplause.\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:10:07\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:10:08\\nReads \\\"First party at Ken Kesey's with Hell's Angels\\\" [from Planet News]. \\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:11:22\\nReads \\\"Uptown\\\" [from Planet News]. \\n \\nAudience\\n00:12:20\\nLaughter and applause\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:12:29\\n[Cut or edit made in tape].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:12:30\\nPerforms \\\"Holy Ghost on the Nod over the Body of Bliss\\\" [from Planet News]. \\n \\nAudience\\n00:14:46\\nApplause.\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:14:52\\nSilence [cut or edit made in tape].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:14:59\\nPerforms \\\"Hari Om Namah Shivaya” chant, accompanying himself on harmonium. \\n \\nAudience\\n00:25:17\\nApplause.\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:25:22\\nPerforms \\\"The Lamb\\\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:27:00\\nPerforms \\\"The Little Black Boy\\\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:30:11\\nPerforms \\\"Holy Thursday\\\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:31:37\\nI'll finish the Blake with \\\"The Nurse's Song\\\". Get up a little closer to me.\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:31:52\\nPerforms\\\"The Nurse's Song\\\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later as “Nurses Song” on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:32:27\\nNo...start again.\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:32:32\\nPerforms \\\"The Nurse's Song\\\", accompanying himself on harmonium [recorded later as “Nurses Song” on Songs of Innocence and Experience].\\n \\nAudience\\n00:35:58\\nApplause.\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:36:05\\nSilence [cut or edit made in tape].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:36:13\\nThe continuation of a long poem on these dates. Some of those who are specialists, some of those who are specialists in poesy will know a text published in a book I've been reading from, Planet News [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q7201132], called \\\"Wichita Vortex Sutra\\\". This is the continuation of the same long poem a year later, bringing the war, the mental war up to 1967. January, 1967. Related to the poem \\\"Wichita Vortex Sutra\\\" in that it's crossing the central part of the United States [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q30] again, north of Kansas [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1558] through Nebraska [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1553], passing again by Lincoln [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q28260], Nebraska. A trip between Wichita, Kansas and Lincoln, Nebraska two...a year and a half earlier having been the subject of the text \\\"Wichita Vortex Sutra\\\". This continuation.\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:37:09\\nReads [“Returning North of Vortex\\\", published later in The Fall of America: Poems of These States].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:43:12\\nA continuation of the same poem, between Kansas City [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q41819] and St. Louis [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q38022]. Middle of the long poem on these dates.\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:43:22\\nReads [\\\"Kansas City to Saint Louis\\\", published later in The Fall of America: Poems of These States].\\n \\nAudience\\n00:52:41\\nApplause.\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:52:46\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:52:47\\nReads \\\"Car Crash\\\" [published later in The Fall of America: Poems of These States; audience laughter throughout].\\n\\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:58:17\\nAnd July 4th, 1969. \\\"Orange hawkeye\\\"--Hawkeye is a New York state [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1384] flower, a flower that grows in New York state, very tiny, bright orange, eyeball with a tiny brown, brownish, purplish pupil.\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n00:58:35\\nReads [\\\"Independence Day\\\", published later in The Fall of America: Poems of These States]\\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n01:00:49\\nFinish with a mantra. Well or, read one last poem, which has been distributed by Dakota Broadsides, they're people from Logos, or connected with Logos, I think. Is that not right? Yeah. I'll pass these out, I think. It's a poem written in Grant Park [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q159085] on August 28th, '68, during the Democratic Convention. Uh, Grant Park, the day after the election of, or the day after the nomination of Humphrey [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q209989]. \\n \\nAllen Ginsberg\\n01:01:27\\nReads unnamed poem.\\n \\nAudience\\n01:02:25\\nApplause and laughter [cut off].\\n \\nEND\\n01:02:31\\n\",\"notes\":\"Allen Ginsberg reads from Angkor Wat (Fulcrum Press, 1968), Planet News (City Lights Books, 1968), as well as pieces that were published later in The Fall of America: Poems of These States (City Lights Books, 1973). Ginsbger also performs musical versions of William Blake’s Songs of Innocence and Songs of Experience, recorded later on Songs of Innocence and Experience (MGM, 1970). \\n\\n00:00- Recording begins, Ginsberg reads “Morning”. [INDEX: from Planet News (City Lights Books, 1968).] \\n02:23- Reads “Today”. [INDEX: from Planet News (City Lights Books, 1968).] \\n10:08- Reads “First party at Ken Kesey’s with Hell’s Angels”. [INDEX: from Planet News (City Lights Books, 1968).]\\n11:22- Reads “Uptown”. [INDEX: from Planet News (City Lights Books, 1968).]\\n12:30- Reads “Holy Ghost, on the Nod, over the Body of Bliss”. [INDEX: from Planet News (City Lights Books, 1968).]\\n13:50- Chants section of poem, first line “And Santa Barbara rejoices in the alleyways of        Brindaban...”.\\n14:59- Harmonium/music starts, Ginsberg sings “Hari Om Namo Shivaya...”\\n25:22- Sings “Little Lamb, Who Made Thee?” [INDEX: William Blake]\\n27:00- Sings \\\"My mother bore me in the southern wild\\\". [INDEX: William Blake.]\\n30:11- Sings “Twas on a Holy Thursday”. [INDEX: William Blake]\\n31:37- Introduces “The Nurse’s Song”. [INDEX: William Blake]\\n31:52- Sings “The Nurse’s Song”.\\n36:13- Introduces “Wichita Votex Sutra”. [INDEX: from Planet News (City Lights Books,   1968).]\\n37:09- Reads “Wichita Vortex Sutra”.\\n43:12- Introduces continuation of same poem, first line “Leaving K.C., MO...”\\n52:47- Reads “Car Crash”.\\n58:17- Introduces “July 4th, 1969”. [INDEX: hawkeye, New York State flower]\\n58:35- Reads “July 4th, 1969”.\\n1:00:49- Introduces unknown mantra, line “Green air, children sit under trees with the old...”\\n1:01:27- Reads unknown mantra, line “Green air, children sit under trees with the old...”\\n1:02:31.23- END OF RECORDING\",\"title\":\"\",\"credit\":\"\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Sound Recording\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/sgw-poetry-readings/allen-ginsberg-at-sgwu-1969/#2\"}]"],"score":2.9979138},{"id":"1283","cataloger_name":["Bindu,Reddy"],"partnerInstitution":["Concordia University"],"collection_source_collection":["SGWU Reading Series-Concordia University Department of English fonds"],"source_collection_label":["SGWU Reading Series-Concordia University Department of English fonds"],"collection_contributing_unit":["Records Management and Archives"],"source_collection_uri":[""],"collection_image_url":[""],"collection_source_collection_description":["The fonds consists of some administrative records of the SGWU Department of English and the Concordia Department of English between 1971 and 2000. It also consists of some SGWU Department of English records related to student academic activities in the 1940s and to public readings and lectures, and a few interviews, produced between 1966 and 1972. The fonds mainly includes minutes of departmental meetings and some course timetables. It also includes some student papers in bound volumes and 63 sound recordings (80 audio reels) mainly composed of poetry readings (see the Concordia SpokenWeb project which uses this material) but also a few lectures given at SGWU. There are also loose typed sheets describing some of the SGWU poetry readings."],"collection_source_collection_id":["I086"],"persistent_url":["http://archives.concordia.ca/I086"],"item_title":["Gladys Hindmarch and Stan Persky at Sir George Williams University, The Poetry Series, 21 November 1969"],"item_title_source":["Cataloguer"],"item_title_note":["\"GLADYS HINDMARCH I086-11-020\" written on sticker on the spine of the tape's box and on the reel. \"RT 511\" written on sticker on the front of the tape's box and on the back of the box.\n\n\"STAN PERSKY Recorded November 21, 1969 3.75 ips, 1/2 track 1 mil. tape 55 minutes\" written on sticker on the back of the tape's box. \"STAN PERSKY I006/SR137\" written on sticker on the spine of the tape's box. \"I006-11-137\" written on sticker on the reel"],"item_language":["English"],"item_production_context":["Documentary recording"],"item_series_title":["The Poetry Series"],"item_subseries_title":["Poetry 4"],"item_identifiers":["[I086-11-020, I006-11-137]"],"creator_names":["Hindmarch, Gladys","Persky, Stan"],"creator_names_search":["Hindmarch, Gladys","Persky, Stan"],"creators":["[{\"url\":\"http://viaf.org/viaf/38164256\",\"name\":\"Hindmarch, Gladys\",\"dates\":\"1940-\",\"notes\":\"Gladys Maria Hindmarch was born on Vancouver Island in 1940. She completed her Bachelor of Arts and a Master of Arts at the University of British Columbia. There she met poets George Bowering, Frank Davey, David Dawson, James Reid, Fred Wah and critic and professor Warren Tallman and was influential in creating the Tish magazine in 1961. However, she never published her own work in the magazine as she wrote prose. Her first publication was Sketches, published by George Bowering via the English Department of Sir George Williams University in 1970. Hindmarch wrote two novels, The Peter Stories (Coach House Press, 1976) and A Birth Account (New Star Books, 1967), which was followed by Watery part of the world (Douglas & McIntyre, 1988). Hindmarch has taught at Langara College and Capilano Colleges and she continues to live and write in Vancouver.\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Author\",\"Performer\"]},{\"url\":\"http://viaf.org/viaf/57448780\",\"name\":\"Persky, Stan\",\"dates\":\"1941-\",\"notes\":\"Writer, teacher, activist and critic Stan Persky was born in Chicago on January 19, 1941. Early on, he was influenced by the Beat Generation poets and decided he would pursue a career in letters. Persky enrolled in the US Navy, and then moved to San Francisco in the early 1960’s where he became involved with the writers of the San Francisco Renaissance, including Jack Spicer, Robin Blaser and Robert Duncan. Persky’s first publications include Les enfants du paradis (St-Denis Press, 1961) and Moss (Rabbit Mountain College, 1961). In 1966, Persky moved with Robin Blaser to Vancouver, where Persky received his BA and MA degrees from the University of British Columbia. Persky co-founded the Georgia Straight Writing Supplements in the late 60’s, which led to what is now known as New Star Books. Persky and other writers began to publish the works of Milton Acorn, Gerry Gilbert, Jack Spicer, George Bowering, Fred Wah, bill bisset and Daphne Marlatt along with many others. Persky has taught at the Northwest College, Malaspina College, Simon Fraser University and at the Capilano University. Persky published Lives of the French Symbolist poets (White Rabbit Press, 1967),  The Day (Georgia Straight Writing Supplement, 1971), George Bowering published An oral literary history of Vancouver in 1972 in the Beaver Kosmos Series, Slaves (New Star Books, 1974), and Wrestling the angel (Talonbooks, 1976). His first political-themed books, Son of Socred (New Star, 1979), The House That Jack Built (New Star, 1980) and Bennett II (New Star, 1983) gained wide-spread acclaim. His other many publications include At the Lenin Shipyard: Poland and the Rise of the Solidarity Trade Union (New Star, 1981), The Solidarity Sourcebook (New Star, 1981), he edited Flaunting It: A Decade of Gay Journalism From the Body Politic with Henry Flam (New Star, 1982), The Holy Forest with introductions by Robin Blaser and Robert Creeley (Coach Hosue Press, 1998), Buddy’s: Meditations on Desire (New Star Press, 1989) which won a Hubert Evans Non-Fiction Prize nomination, Then we Take Berlin: Stories from the Other Side of Europe (Knopf, 1995), On Kiddie Porn: Sexual Representation, Free Speech and the Robin Sharpe Case with John Dixon (New Star, 2001) and most recently Top Sentence: A Writer’s Education (New Star, 2007). He has been a media commentator for the CBC, and has written for The Globe and Mail, the Vancouver Sun, Saturday Night, The Tyee and dooneyscafe.com as well as other journals. Persky resides in Vancouver and Berlin and continues to lecture and write.\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Author\",\"Performer\"]}]"],"contributors_names":["Bowering, George"],"contributors_names_search":["Bowering, George"],"contributors":["[{\"url\":\"http://viaf.org/viaf/34469976\",\"name\":\"Bowering, George\",\"dates\":\"1935-\",\"notes\":\"\",\"nation\":[],\"role\":[\"Series organizer\",\"Presenter\"]}]"],"Presenter_name":["Bowering, George"],"Series_organizer_name":["Bowering, George"],"Performance_Date":[1969],"material_description":["[{\"side\":\"\",\"image\":\"\",\"other\":\"\",\"extent\":\"1/4 inch\",\"AV_types\":\"Audio\",\"tape_brand\":\"\",\"generations\":\"\",\"Conservation\":\"\",\"equalization\":\"\",\"playback_mode\":\"Mono\",\"playing_speed\":\"\",\"sound_quality\":\"Good\",\"recording_type\":\"Analogue\",\"storage_capacity\":\"\",\"physical_condition\":\"\",\"track_configuration\":\"\",\"material_designation\":\"Reel to Reel\",\"physical_composition\":\"Magnetic Tape\",\"accompanying_material\":\"\",\"other_physical_description\":\"\"},{\"side\":\"\",\"image\":\"\",\"other\":\"\",\"extent\":\"1/4 inch\",\"AV_types\":\"Audio\",\"tape_brand\":\"Scotch\",\"generations\":\"\",\"Conservation\":\"\",\"equalization\":\"\",\"playback_mode\":\"Mono\",\"playing_speed\":\"3 3/4 ips\",\"sound_quality\":\"Good\",\"recording_type\":\"Analogue\",\"storage_capacity\":\"\",\"physical_condition\":\"\",\"track_configuration\":\"Half-track\",\"material_designation\":\"Reel to Reel\",\"physical_composition\":\"Magnetic Tape\",\"accompanying_material\":\"\",\"other_physical_description\":\"\"}]"],"material_designations":["Reel to Reel","Reel to Reel"],"physical_compositions":["Magnetic Tape","Magnetic Tape"],"recording_type":["Analogue","Analogue"],"AV_type":["Audio","Audio"],"playback_mode":["Mono","Mono"],"Dates":["[{\"date\":\"1969 11 21\",\"type\":\"Performance Date\",\"notes\":\"Date written on tape box for I006-11-137\",\"source\":\"Accompanying Material\"}]"],"Location":["[{\"url\":\"https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/22080570\",\"venue\":\"Hall Building Room H-651\",\"notes\":\"\",\"address\":\"1455, Boul de Maisonneuve Ouest, Montreal, Quebec, Canada\",\"latitude\":\"45.4972758\",\"longitude\":\"-73.57893043\"}]"],"Address":["1455, Boul de Maisonneuve Ouest, Montreal, Quebec, Canada"],"Venue":["Hall Building Room H-651"],"City":["Montreal, Quebec"],"content_notes":["Gladys Hindmarch reads a series of short stories later published in The Watery Part of the World (Douglas & McIntyre, 1988). Stan Persky reads from Wrestling the Angel (Talonbooks, 1976) as well as a few unpublished poems."],"contents":["gladys_hindmarch_i086-11-020.mp3 [File 1 of 2]\n\nGeorge Bowering\n00:00:00\nAnother Vancouver [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q24639] night in the series, this will be, this is the final reading of the fall series, and will be picked up again in January. As you know from the propaganda sheets, we're presenting what I consider to be the centre of the Vancouver writing scene. Gladys Hindmarch has been in that scene for ten years, and was associated with all those people who've got all kinds of names over the last few years such as West Coast movement and the Tish movement and the New Wave Canada [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q16] and that sort of business. And Stan Persky [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q2330087], was as much related if not more because he is also a sort of superstar of little magazines [audience laughter] in San Francisco [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q62], and made the usual move up to Vancouver, what, three years ago? And has now become the superstar of the Vancouver writing scene. What's going to happen is that the reading will be split into two pieces. At the beginning, Stan is going to introduce Gladys, and then there will be a break of about ten minutes, and then Gladys is going to introduce Stan. So, I'd like to give you \"Stan and Gladys Evening\".\n \nStan Persky\n00:01:43\n\"Beginning again and again is a natural thing, even when there is a series. Beginning again and again and again, explaining composition and time is a natural thing. It is understood by this time that everything's the same, except composition and time. Composition, and the time of the composition and the time in the composition. Everything is the same except composition and as the composition is different, and always going to be different, everything is not the same. Everything is not the same as the time when, of the composition, and the time in the composition is different. The composition is different, that is certain.\" Gertrude Stein [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q188385].\n \nGladys Hindmarch\n00:02:40\nWhen I whistle, just imagine that it's a very good whistler. \"They know what they're doing\".\n \nGladys Hindmarch\n00:02:53\nReads \"They know what they're doing\" [published later as “Callback” in The Watery Part of the World].\n \nGladys Hindmarch\n00:16:08\nThat's the third in a group of stories, or series of stories that I'm writing. [Audience laughter]. I haven't got a title for this one, it's still in the first day on the trip but it's the seventh story. I call it \"The [Salad (?)] Story\" in my head but I'll have to find a title for it.\n \nGladys Hindmarch\n00:16:54\nReads [\"Nothing is Simple\", published later in The Watery Part of the World].\n \nGladys Hindmarch\n00:33:30\nAnother, I've got lots of others, but I'm just going to read one other short one that's got a number of daydream passages that I don't think I--it's necessary to know which of the day--I mean you can, I think you can get it, it's just call it \"Number 12\" right now it also hasn't got a title. \"Outside deck scene\"--I guess that George [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1239280] didn't say, I used to work as a mess girl and a cook on a West Coast freighter called the Tahsis Prince, I worked on four or five of them because I was relief working, but the main one I worked on went up the west coast of Vancouver Island [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q170479], and not, they have great difficulty getting women to go out there, maybe obvious reasons in these stories so I could almost get a job on it, whereas the other ones I could get jobs if nobody was available, but since on this particular boat, usually nobody was available. One time I was leaving shopping in the Army and Navy and a guy came down the hall and said, Look you know, they're trying to get a hold of you, you've gotta go up there. And I said, come on, now, and sort of walked me back to the hall. And one Christmas run there were fifty one men--lots of people don't want to go out at Christmas, but a lot of the seamen, just work in the summer, so if they can get a job for two weeks they take it. They had fifty one cards on the board and not one of them--and there was a call for a cook, which was a girl's job and a call for an able seaman, and not one of the fifty-one men would go out on the boat--they got a guy who hadn't registered yet went out. This is an end of summer trip, it's not rough at all.\n \nAnnotation\n00:35:42\nReads [\"How It Feels”, published later in The Watery Part of the World].\n \nEND\n00:45:52\n[Cut off abruptly].\n\nstan_persky_i006-11-137.mp3 [File 2 of 2]\n\nGladys Hindmarch\n00:00:00\nStan and I both view Gertrude Stein as sort of eternal and I find that I can never read more than two pages of her at a time, like you just sort of become hypnotized, but she's pretty good to...like when I'm starting, trying to get into something to start to write and if I just read, you know just open one of her books at any sort of page, you know just at random and I just read two or three sentences, sometimes a paragraph, never more than that...and so I'm going to introduce Stan with a couple of Gertrude Stein sentences.  \"There's singularly nothing that makes a difference, a difference in beginning, and in middle, and in ending, except that each generation has something different at which they are all looking. By this I mean so simply that anybody knows it that composition is the difference which makes each and all of them then different from other generations, and this is what makes everything different, otherwise they're all like, and everybody knows it because everybody says it.\" Stan Persky. \n \nStan Persky\n00:01:13\nYeah, I'm doing fine. The reading that I'm going to give is called \"The Day\", and what it is is pieces of everything that I'm onto right now, and so you have to bear with however unable to follow it out. And of course, like what we're trying to do is give you some sense of what it's like to be out where we are. \n\nStan Persky\n00:01:45\nReads \"Notebook, around August 20th, 1969\". \n \nStan Persky\n00:03:34.14\nIs that unbearably fast?\n \nStan Persky\n00:03:38.89\nReads \"Notebook, around August 25th, 1969\".\n \nStan Persky\n00:07:16\n\"Notebook, Sunday, August 29th or 30th, 1969\"  You can see the energy this takes, it's just...[laughter]. This is barely doing it. \"Jim and Franz...\" I'm going to try to read one of these a little more slowly, maybe.\n \nStan Persky\n00:07:42\nReads \"Notebook, Sunday, August 29th or 30th, 1969\".\n \nStan Persky\n00:11:45\nThis one's a longer pull if that's possible. \"The Marriage\". Angela, this is the gossip for you [laughter]. Coming in here, I was thinking, who's sitting in the room, and you'd like to hear your names [laughter]...Arnie...\"The Marriage\". \n \nStan Persky\n00:12:23\nReads \"The Marriage\". \n\nAudience\n00:19:00\nLaughter. \n\nStan Persky\n00:19:04\nTricky dick! [laughter].\n \nStan Persky\n00:19:10\nResumes reading \"The Marriage\".\n \nAudience\n00:27:54\nApplause [cut off]. \n\nUnknown\n00:27:55\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n \nStan Persky\n00:27:57\nReads \"To Gladys\".\n \nAudience\n00:34:54\nLaughter.\n \nStan Persky\n00:34:59\n\"October 24th, 1969\". Did I write this for this, did I write this reading? \n \nStan Persky\n00:35:08\nReads \"October 24th, 1969\".\n \nStan Persky\n00:36:46\nReads \"Jamie\". \n \nStan Persky\n00:39:49\nAnd the last three...\n \nUnknown\n00:39:52\n[Cut or edit made in tape here. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\n \nStan Persky\n00:39:53\nReads \"Wednesday, November 5th, 1969, by Hunter's Creek\".\n \nStan Persky\n00:42:04\nReads \"Fred Study. Notebook, Friday, November 7th, 1969, Fred Study.\"\n \nStan Persky\n00:44:17\nAnd at last, to finish, as far as it's gone, or whatever it is, \"The Day\".\n \nStan Persky\n00:44:26\nReads \"The Day\".\n \nEND\n00:46:38\n[Cut off abruptly]."],"Note":["[{\"note\":\"Year-Specific Information: \\n\\nIn 1969, Gladys Hindmarch was writing and participating in the writing scene in Vancouver. No specific information could be found on Gladys Hindmarch during this year.\\n\\nIn 1969, Persky was living in Vancouver, was published in The Pacific Nation (Vancouver, 1969). He was working on a series of poems called “The Day”, published in Wrestling the Angel (Talonbooks, 1976).\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"Local Connections:\\n\\nGladys Hindmarch went to the University of British Columbia, where she met professor and Poetry Reading Series Committee Member George Bowering. Hindmarch was an integral part of the Vancouver poetry renaissance, and was connected to the important poets of the Vancouver ‘scene’.\\n\\nStan Persky met George Bowering and Stanton Hoffman (Faculty and Poetry Reading Series Committee members) when they were in Vancouver and at University of British Columbia during the same period of time, involved in the poetry scene. Please see The Oral Literary History of Vancouver: Stan Persky’s Section (Beaver Kosmos Folio, #5) for how Bowering and Persky met as well as Persky’s relationship to Gladys Hindmarch. Persky is also associated with Robin Blaser (who also read in 1969), Robert Duncan, Robert Creeley, Allen Ginsberg, as well as many other local Vancouver writers in this series.\",\"type\":\"General\"},{\"note\":\"I086-11-020:\\nOriginal transcript, print catalogue, research and edits by Celyn Harding-Jones\\n\\nAdditional research and edits by Ali Barillaro\\n\\nI006-11-137:\\nOriginal transcript by Rachel Kyne\\n\\nOriginal print catalogue, research and edits by Celyn Harding-Jones\\n\\nAdditional research and edits by Ali Barillaro\\n\",\"type\":\"Cataloguer\"},{\"note\":\"2 reel-to-reel tapes>2 CDs> 2 digital files\",\"type\":\"Preservation\"}]"],"Related_works":["[{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/oral-literary-history-of-vancouver-stan-perskys-section/oclc/85105672&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Bowering, George and Brad Robinson (eds). An Oral Literary History of Vancouver: Stan Persky’s Section. Vancouver: Beaver Kosmos Folios, no. 5, 1973. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/sketches/oclc/499435403&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Hindmarch, Gladys. Sketches. Montreal: Beaver Kosmos Folios, no. 3, 198-?.\\n\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/watery-part-of-the-world/oclc/17479102&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Hindmarch, Gladys. The Watery Part of the World. Toronto: Douglas & McIntyre, 1988.\"},{\"url\":\"http://www.vancouverartinthesixties.com/people/189\",\"citation\":\"“People / Gladys (Maria) Hindmarch”. Ruins in the Process: Vancouver Art in the Sixties.\"},{\"url\":\"http://www.vancouverartinthesixties.com/people/185\",\"citation\":\"“People / Stan Persky”. Ruins in Process: Vancouver Art in the Sixties. Vancouver: The Morris and Helen Belkin Art Gallery, The University of British Columbia and the grunt gallery.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/topic-sentence-a-writers-education/oclc/1151428685&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Persky, Stan. Topic Sentence: A Writer’s Education. Vancouver: New Star Books, 2007.\"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/wrestling-the-angel/oclc/3320699&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Persky, Stan. Wrestling the Angel. Vancouver: Talonbooks, 1977.\"},{\"url\":\"https://dooneyscafe.com/robin-blaser-1925-2009-deaths-duty/\",\"citation\":\"Persky, Stan. “Robin Blaser, 1925-2009: Death’s Duty”. dooneyscafe.com. 8 May 2009. \"},{\"url\":\"https://www.worldcat.org/title/words-we-call-home-celebrating-creative-writing-at-ubc/oclc/923442804&referer=brief_results\",\"citation\":\"Svendsen, Linda. Words We Call Home: Celebrating Creative Writing at UBC. Vancouver: University of British Columbia Press, 1990. \"},{\"url\":\"http://www.abcbookworld.com/view_author.php?id=1850\",\"citation\":\"Twigg, Allen. “Persky, Stan”. BC BookWorld Canada. Vancouver: Simon Fraser University, 2007. \"},{\"url\":\"\",\"citation\":\"“Nook Book”. The Georgian. Montreal: Sir George Williams University, 12  November 1969, page 7. \"},{\"url\":\"\",\"citation\":\"“Stan Persky”. The Writers’ Union of Canada: Members’ Pages. The Writer’s Union of Canada, 2009.\"}]"],"_version_":1853670548901462016,"timestamp":"2026-01-07T14:59:53.477Z","digital_description":["[{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0086_11_0020_back.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0137_back.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Stan Persky Tape Box - Back\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/I0086_11_0020_front.jpg\",\"file_path\":\"\",\"filename\":\"I0006_11_0137_front.jpg\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"\",\"notes\":\"https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-0cAe1GF8xZsc62jpUDXwgvyCd6ZmvSw\",\"title\":\"Stan Persky Tape Box - 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Reel\",\"credit\":\"Drew Bernet\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Photograph\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://files.spokenweb.ca/concordia/sgw/audio/all_mp3/gladys_hindmarch_i086-11-020.mp3\",\"file_path\":\"files.spokenweb.ca>concordia>sgw>audio>all_mp3\",\"filename\":\"gladys_hindmarch_i086-11-020.mp3\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"00:45:52\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"110.1 MB\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"gladys_hindmarch_i086-11-020.mp3 [File 1 of 2]\\n\\nGeorge Bowering\\n00:00:00\\nAnother Vancouver [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q24639] night in the series, this will be, this is the final reading of the fall series, and will be picked up again in January. As you know from the propaganda sheets, we're presenting what I consider to be the centre of the Vancouver writing scene. Gladys Hindmarch has been in that scene for ten years, and was associated with all those people who've got all kinds of names over the last few years such as West Coast movement and the Tish movement and the New Wave Canada [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q16] and that sort of business. And Stan Persky [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q2330087], was as much related if not more because he is also a sort of superstar of little magazines [audience laughter] in San Francisco [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q62], and made the usual move up to Vancouver, what, three years ago? And has now become the superstar of the Vancouver writing scene. What's going to happen is that the reading will be split into two pieces. At the beginning, Stan is going to introduce Gladys, and then there will be a break of about ten minutes, and then Gladys is going to introduce Stan. So, I'd like to give you \\\"Stan and Gladys Evening\\\".\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:01:43\\n\\\"Beginning again and again is a natural thing, even when there is a series. Beginning again and again and again, explaining composition and time is a natural thing. It is understood by this time that everything's the same, except composition and time. Composition, and the time of the composition and the time in the composition. Everything is the same except composition and as the composition is different, and always going to be different, everything is not the same. Everything is not the same as the time when, of the composition, and the time in the composition is different. The composition is different, that is certain.\\\" Gertrude Stein [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q188385].\\n \\nGladys Hindmarch\\n00:02:40\\nWhen I whistle, just imagine that it's a very good whistler. \\\"They know what they're doing\\\".\\n \\nGladys Hindmarch\\n00:02:53\\nReads \\\"They know what they're doing\\\" [published later as “Callback” in The Watery Part of the World].\\n \\nGladys Hindmarch\\n00:16:08\\nThat's the third in a group of stories, or series of stories that I'm writing. [Audience laughter]. I haven't got a title for this one, it's still in the first day on the trip but it's the seventh story. I call it \\\"The [Salad (?)] Story\\\" in my head but I'll have to find a title for it.\\n \\nGladys Hindmarch\\n00:16:54\\nReads [\\\"Nothing is Simple\\\", published later in The Watery Part of the World].\\n \\nGladys Hindmarch\\n00:33:30\\nAnother, I've got lots of others, but I'm just going to read one other short one that's got a number of daydream passages that I don't think I--it's necessary to know which of the day--I mean you can, I think you can get it, it's just call it \\\"Number 12\\\" right now it also hasn't got a title. \\\"Outside deck scene\\\"--I guess that George [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q1239280] didn't say, I used to work as a mess girl and a cook on a West Coast freighter called the Tahsis Prince, I worked on four or five of them because I was relief working, but the main one I worked on went up the west coast of Vancouver Island [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q170479], and not, they have great difficulty getting women to go out there, maybe obvious reasons in these stories so I could almost get a job on it, whereas the other ones I could get jobs if nobody was available, but since on this particular boat, usually nobody was available. One time I was leaving shopping in the Army and Navy and a guy came down the hall and said, Look you know, they're trying to get a hold of you, you've gotta go up there. And I said, come on, now, and sort of walked me back to the hall. And one Christmas run there were fifty one men--lots of people don't want to go out at Christmas, but a lot of the seamen, just work in the summer, so if they can get a job for two weeks they take it. They had fifty one cards on the board and not one of them--and there was a call for a cook, which was a girl's job and a call for an able seaman, and not one of the fifty-one men would go out on the boat--they got a guy who hadn't registered yet went out. This is an end of summer trip, it's not rough at all.\\n \\nAnnotation\\n00:35:42\\nReads [\\\"How It Feels”, published later in The Watery Part of the World].\\n \\nEND\\n00:45:52\\n[Cut off abruptly].\",\"notes\":\"Gladys Hindmarch reads a series of short stories later published in The Watery Part of the World (Douglas & McIntyre, 1988). \\n\\n00:00- George Bowering introduces reading. [INDEX: ‘Vancouver night’, final reading in fall series, January, ‘propaganda sheet’, centre of Vancouver writing scene, West Coast    movement, Tish movement, New Wave Canada, Stan Persky, little magazines, San Francisco, move to Vancouver, Stan introduces Gladys, intermission, Gladys introduces Stan.]\\n01:43- Stan Persky reads Gertrude Stein quote [INDEX: composition, series, composition, time.]\\n02:40- Gladys Hindmarch introduces “They Know What They’re Doing”. [INDEX: originally published in Writing (renamed GSWS) No.3, April 1970; and in Iron, No. 3 as recorded in The Watery Part of the World; perhaps later published as “Callback” in The Watery Part of the World (Douglas & McIntyre, 1988).]\\n02:53- Reads “They Know What They’re Doing”.\\n16:08- Introduces untitled story, dubbed “The Salad Story”, first line “Setting up supper is not nearly so slow...”. [INDEX: third in series of stories, untitled, trip; published later as “Nothing is Simple” in The Watery Part of the World (Douglas & McIntyre, 1988).]\\n16:54- Reads first line “Setting up supper is not nearly so slow...”.\\n33:30- Introduces first line “The sun on my eyes...” [INDEX: short story, daydream passages, preliminary titled “12”, George Bowering, mess cook on a West Coast freighter called “Tahsis Prince”, relief working, Vancouver Island, women, seamen, jobs, treatment of women, Army and Navy, Christmas, summer, cook; perhaps later published as “How it Feels” in The Watery Part of the World (Douglas & McIntyre, 1988).]\\n35:42- Reads first line “The sun on my eyes...”.\\n45:52.62- END OF RECORDING.\\n\\n“Howard Fink List of Poems Read”:\\nPrint catalogue page from archives contains the following information:\\n \\nTitle: Gladys Hindmarch reading her own poetry: Final Fall Reading 1969\\nSource: One 5” reel, 3 3/4 , mono lasting 45 mins.\\nDate: November 21, 1969\\n \\nIntroduction by Stan Persky\\n \\nSpeakers: Stan Persky, Gladys Hindmarch\\n \\n1.Title: They Know What They’re Doing\\nFirst Line: “Nobody is moving quickly…”\\n2. Title: untitled [is poem actually called “Untitled,” or is it just listed on archived print cat. as such?]\\nFirst Line: “Setting up for supper…”\\n3.Title: untitled\\nFirst Line: “The sun in my eye…”\",\"title\":\"\",\"credit\":\"\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Sound Recording\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/sgw-poetry-readings/gladys-hindmarch-at-sgwu-1969/\"},{\"file_url\":\"https://files.spokenweb.ca/concordia/sgw/audio/all_mp3/stan_persky_i006-11-137.mp3\",\"file_path\":\"files.spokenweb.ca>concordia>sgw>audio>all_mp3\",\"filename\":\"stan_persky_i006-11-137.mp3\",\"channel_field\":\"\",\"sample_rate\":\"\",\"duration\":\"\",\"precision\":\"\",\"size\":\"111.9 MB\",\"bitrate\":\"\",\"encoding\":\"\",\"contents\":\"stan_persky_i006-11-137.mp3 [File 2 of 2]\\n\\nGladys Hindmarch\\n00:00:00\\nStan and I both view Gertrude Stein as sort of eternal and I find that I can never read more than two pages of her at a time, like you just sort of become hypnotized, but she's pretty good to...like when I'm starting, trying to get into something to start to write and if I just read, you know just open one of her books at any sort of page, you know just at random and I just read two or three sentences, sometimes a paragraph, never more than that...and so I'm going to introduce Stan with a couple of Gertrude Stein sentences.  \\\"There's singularly nothing that makes a difference, a difference in beginning, and in middle, and in ending, except that each generation has something different at which they are all looking. By this I mean so simply that anybody knows it that composition is the difference which makes each and all of them then different from other generations, and this is what makes everything different, otherwise they're all like, and everybody knows it because everybody says it.\\\" Stan Persky. \\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:01:13\\nYeah, I'm doing fine. The reading that I'm going to give is called \\\"The Day\\\", and what it is is pieces of everything that I'm onto right now, and so you have to bear with however unable to follow it out. And of course, like what we're trying to do is give you some sense of what it's like to be out where we are. \\n\\nStan Persky\\n00:01:45\\nReads \\\"Notebook, around August 20th, 1969\\\". \\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:03:34.14\\nIs that unbearably fast?\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:03:38.89\\nReads \\\"Notebook, around August 25th, 1969\\\".\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:07:16\\n\\\"Notebook, Sunday, August 29th or 30th, 1969\\\"  You can see the energy this takes, it's just...[laughter]. This is barely doing it. \\\"Jim and Franz...\\\" I'm going to try to read one of these a little more slowly, maybe.\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:07:42\\nReads \\\"Notebook, Sunday, August 29th or 30th, 1969\\\".\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:11:45\\nThis one's a longer pull if that's possible. \\\"The Marriage\\\". Angela, this is the gossip for you [laughter]. Coming in here, I was thinking, who's sitting in the room, and you'd like to hear your names [laughter]...Arnie...\\\"The Marriage\\\". \\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:12:23\\nReads \\\"The Marriage\\\". \\n\\nAudience\\n00:19:00\\nLaughter. \\n\\nStan Persky\\n00:19:04\\nTricky dick! [laughter].\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:19:10\\nResumes reading \\\"The Marriage\\\".\\n \\nAudience\\n00:27:54\\nApplause [cut off]. \\n\\nUnknown\\n00:27:55\\n[Cut or edit made in tape. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:27:57\\nReads \\\"To Gladys\\\".\\n \\nAudience\\n00:34:54\\nLaughter.\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:34:59\\n\\\"October 24th, 1969\\\". Did I write this for this, did I write this reading? \\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:35:08\\nReads \\\"October 24th, 1969\\\".\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:36:46\\nReads \\\"Jamie\\\". \\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:39:49\\nAnd the last three...\\n \\nUnknown\\n00:39:52\\n[Cut or edit made in tape here. Unknown amount of time elapsed].\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:39:53\\nReads \\\"Wednesday, November 5th, 1969, by Hunter's Creek\\\".\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:42:04\\nReads \\\"Fred Study. Notebook, Friday, November 7th, 1969, Fred Study.\\\"\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:44:17\\nAnd at last, to finish, as far as it's gone, or whatever it is, \\\"The Day\\\".\\n \\nStan Persky\\n00:44:26\\nReads \\\"The Day\\\".\\n \\nEND\\n00:46:38\\n[Cut off abruptly].\",\"notes\":\"Stan Persky reads from Wrestling the Angel (Talonbooks, 1976) as well as a few unpublished poems.\\n\\n00:00- Gladys Hindmarch introduces Stan Persky. [INDEX: Gertrude Stein, reading Stein, Stein quote.]\\n01:13- Stan Persky introduces reading and the poem “Notebook, around August 20th, 1969”. [INDEX: reading called “The Day”, current work; published in Wrestling the Angel (Talonbooks, 1976), titled “It Starts with This”.]\\n01:45- Reads “Notebook, around August 20th, 1969”.\\n03:35- Stan asks audience about speed of his reading.\\n03:38- Reads “Notebook, around August 25th, 1969”.\\n07:16- Introduces “Notebook, around August 29th or 30th, 1969”. [INDEX: energy, Jim, Franz, reading more slowly.]\\n07:42- Reads “Notebook, around August 29th, or 30th, 1969”.\\n11:45- Introduces “The Marriage”. [INDEX: longer poem, Angela, gossip, audience, Arnie (random audience names); published in Wrestling the Angel (Talonbooks, 1976).]\\n12:23- Reads “The Marriage”.\\n18:56- Interrupts poem [INDEX: interruption, tricky dick.]\\n19:10- Continues “The Marriage”.\\n27:57- Reads “To Gladys”. [INDEX: Robert Creeley, Robert Duncan, Pound’s Canto 29, H.D. Warren Tallman.]\\n34:59- Introduces “October 24th, 1969”. [INDEX: write poem for reading.]\\n35:08- Reads “October 24th, 1969”. [INDEX: Robert Duncan, Robert Creeley.]\\n36:46- Reads “Jamie”. [INDEX: Tish magazine, James Reed.]\\n39:53- Reads “Wednesday, November 5th, 1969, by Hunter’s Creek”.\\n42:04- Reads “Fred Study. Notebook, Friday, November 7th, 1969”\\n44:26- Introduces “The Day”.\\n44:26- Reads “The Day”.\\n46:38.09- END OF RECORDING.\",\"title\":\"\",\"credit\":\"\",\"caption\":\"\",\"content_type\":\"Sound Recording\",\"featured\":\"\",\"public_access_url\":\"https://montreal.spokenweb.ca/sgw-poetry-readings/stan-persky-at-sgwu-1969/\"}]"],"score":2.9979138}]